Lanmoor Options

[RonLaden]

Hi All,

I am about to start out for the first time in model railway.

The only time I have been involved if you can call it that was 50 years ago when I had a boxed Hornby train set for Christmas, so I am a complete beginner.

I will probably have a hundred and one questions over the next few months so please bear with me.

I have a small workshop which will allow me an L shaped layout measuring 6 feet x 6 feet x 3 feet.
I would like to have some continious running and the maximum radius I can afford will be 15 inches, my first question is will this be ok for most rolling stock.
I will probably only be running small loco,s like pannier tanks or similar.

I have seen advertised what I assume is budget track i.e. 20 x 2ft 5in lenghts of nickel silver flexitrack for £22. Any thoughts on this and will it be ok or not.

I have been reading the magazines and library books to try and get some idea for starting out and I think I am starting to get my head around the basics like wiring etc.

When it comes to turnouts which is considered the best to go with insulated frogs or live frogs.

I have been considering a Gaugemaster panel controller the two track with simulation, is this a good choice or should I be considering something else. I cant afford DCC at the moment and would prefer to start out with conventional control.

I guess thats enough of me rattling on at the moment but would appreciate your experience and appreciate your help as I go along.

cheers
Ron

[Edwin]

You'll be fine with 15" radius, all N gauge stock will work down to 12" and much of it even less. This may not look very good however, especially with longer coaches and wagons, so consider hiding the tighter curves in tunnels or behind hills and buildings.

I got some budget track from Gaugemaster and it was definitely inferior to Peco. Not very realistic and not very easy to form into tight curves, and the rail was a bit wider so wouldn't fit into Peco joiners only their own type. I used it up in hidden areas but if I was starting again now I'd use Peco code 80 for all the hidden track. Peco code 55 is better looking and stronger but more expensive.

[cupoftea]

Good advice from Edwin.

I am starting out too and have done quite a bit of testing with different radius curves. I found that the locos I tested would negotiate a 9 inch radius but, as Edwin says, Farish quote that their Bo-Bo and Co-Co locos are optimised for 12 inch minimum radius and so anything less would be right on the locos working limits. I was concerned about using using smaller radius curves because I don't like the idea of constantly working any machine at its working limit and also Trains look a whole lot better negotiating larger radius curves. The tightest curve on the layout I am building is 12 inches.

Personally i would stick with Peco track - it is of known quality and will stand the test of time. I don't know for sure but budget track may give problems over time (they must be saving the money somehow) and for the small saving is it worth the 'risk'?

Points wise I would definitely pick electrofrog - especially if you plan to use smaller locos.

When designing my layout I fell into the 'trap' of trying to cram as much track into a given layout as possible but when mocked up it did not look right. Just a personal thing perhaps but I found that, to my eyes at least, less was more and by reducing the amount of track and keeping it simple I ended up with a far more satisfying look to the layout.

Have a great time designing and building your layout and never be afraid to ask questions. The folks on this forum are very helpful and a mine of good information.

[Robert Stokes]

You say that you can't afford DCC yet. But why not start with the Bachmann E-Z which is an inexpensive NMRA-compliant DCC controller for about £45? (Hatton's price last time I looked.) This can't be any more than the price of a good double track conventional controller. I realise that you must add about £15 or so for a decent decoder for each loco but surely you are only going to have a couple of them at the start. That way you avoid all the complications of conventional wiring and switches. (Is DCC pretty much conventional now?)

Many people on this site will advise getting a better DCC controller from the start, but if you can't afford one and intend converting later, the E-Z won't make much difference in the long run.

Good luck with the project whatever you decide.
Robert

[db ice 3]

i agree with robert above ... also you can sell on your bachmann e-z controller on ebay and put the money towards a better controller in the future!

or buy this one maybe? :-

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/E-Z-Command-digital-...=item1e60d8c605

and sell it on again when you go to upgrade! - this has to be the cheapest way into dcc!

[RonLaden]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the advice.

Hmmm now its got me thinking I didnt realise you can have DCC control for £50.

Been a complete beginner can you please explain how the track wiring becomes simpler with DCC.

Also do I take it that with DCC you can set a loco running and then select another loco on another part of the track and the first loco will keep operating. So you can operate a number of locos from the one controller at the same time..?

Are the decoders now available to fit all N gauge loco,s including smaller types like the pannier tank or is it only available for larger types.

cheers
Ron

[GLDav66]

Hi Ron,

Welcome to MRF.

I was starting out in N at the back end of last year and this forum has been invaluable. I imagine some of the more experienced members will be along to give their advice, also, the search forum facility answered lots of my original questions.! I recommend joining the N Gauge Society you will not regret it. As for DCC, I had the usual debate with myself about DC versus DCC. There is an excellant article some of the guys put together comparing DCC systems and having read it I am opting for the NCE Powercab which costs about £135. No more switches, complex wiring isolators etc!!

Keep us posted on how you get on

Glenn

[Robert Stokes]

The wiring for DCC is much simpler. The adverts say that you only need two wires, one for each rail. That is true, but a bit misleading. Providing that you have no reverse loops or triangle junctions, then you only need power to each rail, BUT it is best to have lots of connections around the layout to be sure that power gets everywhere.

The way to do this, is to have two thick wires (called bus wires for some obscure reason) running around under the layout. From these thinner wires (called droppers - why not risers?) take power up through the baseboard to the track in several places. Some people on this site say use a pair of droppers for every individual piece of track, but I don't think that this is entirely necessary.

Since I've always been an 00 modeller, I can't advise on decoders for n-gauge.

[Sprintex]

Decoders are getting smaller all the time, and I would've thought either a TCS-Z2 or the CT Electronik DCX74zD (pictured below) would fit into the smallest of locos. The CT chip fitted easily into the cab of my Class 04 shunter




Paul

[bluedepot]

hello and welcome ron

good luck with your layout


tim

[webbo]

[quote name='RonLaden' date='14 Jan 2011, 19:45' post='175123']
Hi All,

I am about to start out for the first time in model railway.

The only time I have been involved if you can call it that was 50 years ago when I had a boxed Hornby train set for Christmas, so I am a complete beginner.

I will probably have a hundred and one questions over the next few months so please bear with me.

I have a small workshop which will allow me an L shaped layout measuring 6 feet x 6 feet x 3 feet.
I would like to have some continious running and the maximum radius I can afford will be 15 inches, my first question is will this be ok for most rolling stock.
I will probably only be running small loco,s like pannier tanks or similar.

I have seen advertised what I assume is budget track i.e. 20 x 2ft 5in lenghts of nickel silver flexitrack for £22. Any thoughts on this and will it be ok or not.

I have been reading the magazines and library books to try and get some idea for starting out and I think I am starting to get my head around the basics like wiring etc.

When it comes to turnouts which is considered the best to go with insulated frogs or live frogs.

I have been considering a Gaugemaster panel controller the two track with simulation, is this a good choice or should I be considering something else. I cant afford DCC at the moment and would prefer to start out with conventional control.

I guess thats enough of me rattling on at the moment but would appreciate your experience and appreciate your help as I go along.

cheers
Ron


Hi Ron

And welcome to N gauge.

I model CP Rail but I also have a small number of British steam locomotives and rolling stock. I suppose the answer to the issue of what the minimum radius should be is really whether the equipment will go round corners properly or not. Basically I like big trains and powerful locomotives pulling them. I am building a layout that has a minimum of 18" radius on curves but I'm hoping that I can drag ~25 double bogie coal hoppers or grain hoppers round such bends without probem. The locomotives I have certainly have the grunt - SD40s and ES44ACs .

Best wishes
Ian

[RonLaden]

Hi guys

Thanks again for all the advice.

When it comes to DCC can the decoders only be fitted to "DCC ready" locos or can they be fitted to any.

Or does the "DCC ready" mean that a decoder is already fitted.

cheers
Ron

[RonLaden]

Hi

I forgot to ask is the fitting of the decoders easy or complicated and what needs to be done to fit them.

cheers
Ron

[Edwin]

DCC Ready (or "DCC 6" on the Graham Farish website) means the loco has a socket into which a decoder can be plugged. In N gauge it is normally a 6-pin socket and for these you need a decoder with the 6 pins already attached. Some decoders are also too large to fit into particular locos - if you have a loco in mind then post it on here and no doubt someone will recommend a decoder that fits. Assuming there is space, fitting a decoder is easy and the hardest thing is usually getting the body off. Most Dapol locos have a 6-pin socket along with the more recent Farish models - for steam just the LMS 4-6-0s and the B1 at the moment. The Peco Collett 0-6-0 is the only British N gauge loco to come with a decoder already fitted.

Some slightly older Farish diesels have "PCB DCC" where you have to get a decoder with wires and solder these wires onto the PCB. This is quite a bit more difficult but by no means impossible.

The even older Farish steam and diesel locos, and some of the smaller recent ones, have no provision for DCC. These can all be fitted with a bit of skill and effort but obviously more difficult than other types - again post on here if you have a specific model in mind. If you don't feel confident in having a go yourself then there are people who will fit them for you (at a price!).

[Sprintex]

Hi guys

Thanks again for all the advice.

When it comes to DCC can the decoders only be fitted to "DCC ready" locos or can they be fitted to any.

Or does the "DCC ready" mean that a decoder is already fitted.

cheers
Ron

"DCC Ready" means the loco comes with a 6-pin socket fitted inside, usually containing a blanking plate to make it run OK on DC. To convert it you simply unplug the blanking plate, plug in your chip, programme it with an 'address' ( a number you use to select it on your controller) and away you go!

Decoders can be fitted to almost any loco: DCC ready ones explained above, some locos are marked as DCC-PCB which means they do not have a socket, but they have tags on the circuit board which make DCC conversion easy, though for these you will require a hardwire decoder as opposed to a plug in one. Should just be a case of soldering the decoder in. Those generally older ones that are neither DCC-ready or DCC-PCB will probably need more extensive work, such as fitting specially insulated sleeves to the motor brushes (called a digihat) or even modifying the chassis itself. If you're not confident butchering a brand new loco then you should probably trust this work to one of the companies out there that will do the work for you and test it. Digitrains is one such highly reputable company that will do this for around £15-£20 per loco

Hi

I forgot to ask is the fitting of the decoders easy or complicated and what needs to be done to fit them.

cheers
Ron

This depends on what you deem as 'easy' and how much mechanical/electrical knowledge you have See reply above.


Paul