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> Tracklaying - cork base needed or not, Is a cork base necessary
DavidG
post 1 Jan 2010, 21:34
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As a returnee to modelling after many years absence I am looking to start building again. I have built my baseboards using Sundeala board. Do I need to use a cork base for either quieter running or to create a ballast shoulder or for any other reason? Some layouts I have seen have a distinct shoulder but others do not so I began to wonder if I could dispense with the cork base.
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frame69
post 1 Jan 2010, 21:37
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I dont use anything and Im quite happy with it.
Regards Frame.


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Manfred Ebinger
post 1 Jan 2010, 21:42
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Hi David
It's really up to you what you do. The cork is used to create a ballast shoulder. Noise reduction is not what it's used for if you pin the track through the cork and then ballast the track. The noise is transmitted throught the glued ballast into the baseboard. If you want a shoulder you can use cork or foam or whatever material you think is suitable.
It really boils down to how you want your track to look when it is ballasted.


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craw
post 1 Jan 2010, 22:13
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Hi David
Totally agree with Manfred it is a personal preference
to use or not.
John
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Robert Stokes
post 2 Jan 2010, 09:58
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I made a previous layout with sundeala and did not use cork underlay. Running wasn't noisy even though I had pinned the track straight to the sundeala. It's up to you whether you want to create the ballast shoulder in some way.

Good luck with the project whatever you decide.
Robert.


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My layout "Horton-cum-Whinton" is 1950's midland region with Settle and Carlisle flavour.
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My replacement for the above layout.
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Da7thSon
post 2 Jan 2010, 11:16
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Just on this note.. don't get creative and try something different. I tried lamminate flooring underlay and i'm in all kinds of problems with track being uneven (not down the length, but across it) and its causing isses with loco's derailing and points sad.gif . Good job its only my test layout before the loft one gets built!
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Busbar
post 4 Jan 2010, 12:51
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I have read elsewhere that laminate flooring underlay was a successful track underlay and, obviously you have found otherwise. If my memory is correct heavy duty wallpaper paste was used to fix it. I would be interested in what adhesive you used and more details of the problems.
Has anybody else had experience of using the underlay?
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alastairq
post 4 Jan 2010, 14:55
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if using a 'soft' underlay, then that itself needs to be on a firm foundation.

if problems occur with uneveness of trackage..then a likley cause is unequal fixing pressures of track to underlay.

On the late Ken Northwood's GWR layout of the '50's, he devised a 'floating' track method...whereby [flex] track was sat on top of a strip of foam rubber......sandwiched in between was a strip of card.

this had its edges folded downs [ballast shoulder] and had ballast glued to it........the edges of the card strip were NOT glued down, thus as the foam rubber compressed with the passage of trains [and his were HEAVY].....so the card strip flexed too......track itself was located by small pins, into the [ply??] sub-base.....for lateral location...but the pins were NOT pushed fully home, standing proud a little bit, of the sleepers....thus allowing vertical movement.


the point being, not to rigidly afix the track.



in Da's defence, I have also noticed a tendency for peco points to 'bow' when track is affixed........they dont' seem quite as 'rigid' as one would like.

to avoid this, I have tried various methods of securing peco points in the past......not pinning them is one......another was to mount all the pointwork on a 'solid' track base...connecting trackwork being flexibly mounted......this rather defeated the object of a flexible tack base........in the end, a swift pass with a bastard mill file generally re-levelled peco points.......although after a few years, code 100 became code 92.
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Campaman
post 4 Jan 2010, 14:58
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I have used Laminate flooring underlay, the foam type about 3mm thick with no problems at all, I glued it down with contact adhesive (Evostick) but I did not pin the track I glued that as well.


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Andy
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chrismac
post 4 Jan 2010, 15:42
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QUOTE (alastairq @ 4 Jan 2010, 14:55) *
in Da's defence, I have also noticed a tendency for peco points to 'bow' when track is affixed........they dont' seem quite as 'rigid' as one would like.

to avoid this, I have tried various methods of securing peco points in the past......not pinning them is one......another was to mount all the pointwork on a 'solid' track base...connecting trackwork being flexibly mounted......this rather defeated the object of a flexible tack base........in the end, a swift pass with a bastard mill file generally re-levelled peco points.......although after a few years, code 100 became code 92.


I have started to convert Peco N points to DCC friendly and straight out of the packet they are bowed when checked with a steel straight edge.
It is a case of a light touch and very gentle persuasion to straighten them so they sit flat before starting work on them.

Chris



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Da7thSon
post 4 Jan 2010, 15:53
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They are PECO points (set track ones) i'm using. The laminate underlay is the 3mm stuff from B&Q but i think the tolerances arn't that great and as its springy as well, i think how they package it has caused imperfections in it. It was glued down using PVA and then the track was track pinned over the top of it with the edge of the underlay then cut to the edge of the track for ballasting. The baseboard is solid 9mm ply and was smooth before installing the underlay.

As well as having to scrap away the ballast and pack under the points to get them level i've had to add some guide rails built from old track, bent and glued in place. All works now, but it was a real pain.



I will defiantly be constructing the Loft layout using either 9mm ply with cork under the track, or sundella with track directly onto that.

Andy
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chrismac
post 4 Jan 2010, 15:58
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Forget Sundeala go for a good quality ply with or without the cork as it will more stable.

Chris
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enM
post 4 Jan 2010, 17:30
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I have used the wood floor underlay from B & Q. I have used the self adhesive to stick it to the plywood board (9mm) and it sticks like sh*t. It does need careful laying to stop stretch, and to have a level surface. I then put stuck cork under the track for ballast height. I have stuck the track down on the cork. I never attempted to pin it down as guessed it would easily pull the track and cork down into the foam. I had already bought enough cork to cover the boards and got fed up with cutting the cork so ended up laying cork where the sidings are as well as the main track.

On the boards with points these are hinged to enable easy access to work on the motrs and wiring. At the edges I did originally put the copper board and soldered the track onto the copper board. However this did get pulled down into the foam so replaced this with the C & L finescale baseboard track end protectors.

I have found if you put something heavy down on the foam is does indent it. Not a problem where there is no track as can be taken up within the scenic modelling.
Would I use it again on the next layout. At the moment the answer is yes there is such a difference in board noise to having it fixed to the baseboard by pins or directly on plywood. No direct UV on the foam so it is a case of time to see if the foam is like the open foam which disintegrates with time. Have used neoprene in the past in my job which did not suffer degradation over a long period of time (10 years or more). Did look to see if I could get some but couldn,t so triedthe B & Q floor uderlay.
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kiwionrails
post 4 Jan 2010, 17:41
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For my (planned rolleyes.gif ) Dock layout i'd be having a large area 'paved', and i have a feeling this will act as a speaker and amplify the noise. What i was wondering is how would i go about reducing the noise produced, or will i just have to put up with it.

Thanks

Kiwionrails


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madon37s
post 4 Jan 2010, 19:30
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QUOTE (kiwionrails @ 4 Jan 2010, 17:41) *
What i was wondering is how would i go about reducing the noise produced


Don't run any trains biggrin.gif that'll stop the noise thumbsup.gif

Seriously though I have never used cork or any sound defening material as I quite like the sound of the trains running, after all the real trains don't run on cork do they thumbsup2.gif

Kind regards

Paul


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Best day of my life = Getting married to Sue my wife. Second best day! = Riding behind 37429 in Regional Railways livery thrashing away on the North Wales Coast line with my best mate.

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