[kristopher1805]

The Hornby bogie looks right to the Vulcan Foundry built 1157/1158 which I have photos of whilst on delivery to Gorton taken at London Road Manchester, there were a lot of detail differences between the manufacturers but this would not spoil the model for me.

I have both and the Hornby is a better model probably because the Bachmann is a rehash of the old Replica effort whilst the Hornby is totally new, that said the Bachmann is cheaper so that tends to balance the thing out, still I am going to buy another Hornby one.

 

[rb277170]

Thanks guys. I'm in no immediate rush , so will wait it out and see if the prices drop as with the 4MT.

Russell

 

[34C]

Same here! Going to wait on a suitable Hornby variant for the Southern end of Eastern Region, with the hope that prices drop in the summer. My very worn Bach split chassis Bongo can limp on until then, making realistic mechanical complaints from its knackered condition.

I liked the comment 'a B1 is a B1 is a B1' in respect of the original body Replica had tooled up by Kader. At the time of release twenty some years ago that was far and away the best OO RTR loco model for appearance - less said about the decent looking chassis the better - so it is a good yardstick for progress since.

 

[60159]

To me, Russell, the Bachmann tender gap is unacceptable to my eye and I'll need to sort it as I have done with previous B1. The Model Rail input was unusually frank when comparing the two B1s and was clearly in favour of the Hornby (although gave a few consolation plusses to the Bachmann. I agree a clearer side by side would have been helpful, however.

As you say, 34C, the old Replica B1 was a superb model in its day and my original 61132 (weathered, and fitted with a later Bachmann split chassis and subsequent replaced axle bushes) still looks the business but does not run well (forwards, bizarrely reverse is much better and quite acceptable), and wheels are prone to slipping out of axle bushes when cleaning them.

I'd like to have a Hornby B1 as well but can't really justify it right now, but if there are to be bargains in the future, then I could be tempted. Will ebay soon be flooded with old split chassis versions?

The choice between competing models is always difficult even when looking at both in the flesh - pics are not always the most helpful. It is really only in use and seeing them in the context of one's layout that things become more apparent. I'm not a rivet counter but look to see what seems/appears right and gives the right atmosphere/feel.

Right, maybe I'll go and tackle the coal, starting by carefully cutting the moulded coal from the rear (unweathered!) upstand of the bunker, or should I just drop a wee complaint to Bachmann. On second thoughts, I think I'll have a beer!

Mike

 

[Coboman]

The old split chassis ones are still commanding up to £45, which I find quite supprising as I've always thought it was Bachmanns worst chassis by no small margin. I hate Hornbys bogie and pony wheel tyres on all their models. They just look wrong. Its time they upgraded them all.

 

[nick lamkin]

I closed the gap between the loco and tender of my B1 as soon as I got it out of the box. There are 2 ways of doing this.

Method one - glue some squares of plasticard on the inside the rear of the chassis that way the hook will locate further under the loco. How much pasticard you depends on the radius of your tightest curve.

Method 2 - cut off the upright peg off the the tender drawbarby cutting through the drawbar behuin the peg. Then drill a hole through the remains of drawbar - I personally use a craft knife to make this hole and do it from the underside so that the taper matches the peg - then shove the peg up through this new hole and flood with liquid poly.

Nick

 

[60159]

Now had a response from Bachmann re non weathering of rear upstand on bunker (integral with coal load) viz -

"Thank you for your enquiry. Unfortunately it looks like that is the way the model has been made and that this piece has not been weathered as the coal was not required to be weathered."

So, not a case of wrong part being fitted, just a corner being cut or lack of attention to detail in planning production.

 

[Kevin Appleby]

Good debate guys, I blogged about this a few days ago

I think I'm convinced now to go for the Hornby version

 

[60159]

Having been critical of my new, new Bachmann B1, I have now done the coal (cut away the moulded coal load from the rear bunker upstand and put in real coal), weathered the rear bunker upstand and converted the tender coupling to have much closer coupling and given the loco a good run, I'm now very pleased with it. It looks good and I have to say it runs extremely well. Shouldn't have to go through all this with a brand new loco but maybe worth the effort.

 

[nick lamkin]

In response to 60159 - I suspect just apathy on behalf of the person at Bachmann who replied.

 

[theakerr]

A practical questions!. I can remember the 1:1 B1,s pulling 13/14 coach trains. My current Bachmann B1's manage to pull 9 close coupled and gangwayed Hornby Gresleys on a nominally level circuit. I read on one post that the pulling power of the Bachmann B1 seems to be down on the new chassis. Does anyone have pulling numbers for either or (or both) the new Bachmann and the Hornby? Also, does anyone know if it is possible to add extra weight to either?

 

[kristopher1805]

The pulling power of the Hornby is greater than that of the Bachmann based on the 2 new Hornby and 1 new Bachmann I now have running. I have not looked into the body of either so do not know if there is space left over although a peer underneath tends to show there cannot be much scope on either.

The Bachmann definitely struggled with a rake of 15 Wrenn wagons even when run in (being a month older) whilst the Hornby shifted it when new and not run in, in fact I have put the Bachmann to work hauling a 5 rake of Bachmann GUV's as I thought I was being cruel to make it struggle especially when quite new, I should think 14 heavy coaches and it would die of fright.

The Hornby then is better but its no Bachmann 9F, nor Wrenn 8F or any other heavy hauler, doubt it is quite as good as a Hornby Black 5 but of course it may well improve as it gets older.

As to loads father had this problem, out footplate riding he gets to Sheffield and finds one of the Gorton B1's waiting to go forward to Manchester and he promptly joins the crew whom he knows well. They chat and tease give him the shovel and the driver gets the all clear, off they go but father finds it hard going for a B1 in supposedly good condition, anyway he makes the valiant effort and eventually Woodhead Tunnel comes in sight when the crew all solicitous sit him down, take away shovel and suggest he enjoy the rest of the trip.

Wiping brow he suggests it was unduly hard work when the driver points back down the train and he sees this going away into the distance, instead of the usual 8 there was at least 14 bogies on the back!

 

[34C]

The Bach B1 is light as supplied, but for those prepared to ballast it themselves the body cavity is still the same size as on the split chassis model which was heavy enough for realistic traction, and lead is denser than mazak. Mine hasn't had the running to get its tyres fully polished up yet, but weighted to similar to the split chassis model (which will pull 14 on level track) has no trouble with 11 Bach mk1s on, I will give it a maximum traction assessment after a couple of weeks regular use.

 

[theakerr]

Thanks 34C & kristopher. A response on another forum indicated that if one is prepared to relocate some wires on the new Bachmann there is room to add additional weight. He also indicated that the front bogie is parasitic and that reducing the spring load improved pulling ability on the old split chassis. Assuming the front bogie is still the same this might improve the situation. I plan to play around with the bogie spring tonight on my old split chassis locos.

 

[34C]

'34theletterbetweenBandD' = 34C. The last time RMweb crashed and burned I fell off the membership list, but it wouldn't let me rejoin as 34C for some reason.

General note, until they introduced the Fairburn 2-6-4T model in about 2006/7; Bachmann consistently oversprung carrying wheels. It is a fault 'on the right side' in that it usually helps trackholding and especially so on set track, and most set track layouts being small don't require overmuch traction. But on a layout using a flexitrack system or better, larger radius curves and points, gentle gradient transitions and other good stuff; cutting coil springs down very significantly (typically to a third or quarter original size) and backing off flat springs provides adequate track holding and opften very significant gaions in traction.

Bonus: Hornby often draw springs on bogies in their service diagrams, but until the L1 came into my possession, they were never to be seen on the actual models. So, what to do with all those Bachmann coil spring offcuts? Difficult one that..

 

[Phipps]

I was considering just a single B1 on my Preserved line(bit of modellers licence),but wondered if the forthcoming LNER green 1123 might be worth having?I'm not too fussy about details,just as long as it would be able to haul four Lima maroon Mk1s or budget Gresley teaks.

 

[kristopher1805]

Phipps, Yes easily it is a great model

 

[theakerr]

To follow up on my previous post, I did shorten the front bogie spring on one of B1's and at the same time put some graphite powder onto the bogie axles. There is an improvement. I can pull at least two extra coaches without it slipping. As I understand it Bachmann have not upgraded the front bogie on the new version chassis, so this remedy will apply to them as well

 

[Phipps]

Thanks Kristopher.I'm none-too-fussed about a super high spec model particularly,but rather one in the LNER apple green colours.I know that there's always a chance of the 1306 Mayflower one day,but I'd liked the idea of a fictitiously-preserved example & apple green is a popular preserved livery(4472,4771,8572 & 1306).
I realise that Hornby's has very accurate touches,but I'd always kept my distance from Bachmann's chassis too.

 

[theakerr]

One of my old "detailed" split chassis B1s just gave up the ghost and I just ordered the cheapest BR new version I could find. As received it was about 40 gms lighter than the old split chassis. Without any "cutting" I was able to get at least 30gms additional weight into it, most of it directly over the centre wheel. My old split chassis loco would pull 9 coaches and 10 with some slip. The new one with the extra weight will pull 12 hornby Gresleys. Very nice smooth runner - this may have helped with the trac tion since the old one was always jerky at slower speeds and from starting off