[hildo]

Looks like bachmann's new dcc system is going to be a challenger in the dcc stakes, spoke with a local dealer who was at the toy fair and has seen bachmann's system working he was very impressed.
Unit is quite small but appears to have good features,if the price is under £100 it can only be good for dcc,hornby will have to get the elite up to same spec.
I have seen the elite at a hornby demo last nov and to be fair to hornby it worked ok but since then they have had troubles, time will tell who has the better system,nothing like a bit of competion.

 

[Gary]

Its interesting that Bachmann seem to deliver the technology very soon after any announcement and take their time with the models. Hornby deliver the models and take their time with the technology.

If the whole Dynamis system is £90 then it is an absolute bargain. It will be another Nintendo Wii. The wireless technology seems to be associated with a Pro package and that price has yet to be revealed so the actual package with everything may be more. Does anybody know any different on this?

I wonder what sort of age group Dynamis will appeal to?

The control pad has a lot of small buttons and a small screen which seems to display small characters.

Contrast this with the Hornby Elite with its bigger buttons (two traditional knobs suggesting the control of two locomotives at a time) and characters.

Older modellers the Elite?

Younger modellers Dynamis?

Isn't it great that the whole world is suddenly looking and taking notice at what the British are being offered DCC wise.

Who would have thought that Britain would be a DCC hotbed 2 years ago!

Happy modelling
Gary

 

[Ravenser]

I think we will have to wait and see until both are out (when both come out will be a factor in the equation) .

What is announced as a spec has to be dilivered in practice - enough people have come a cropper flaming Bachmann on the basis of preproduction mockups for it to be unwise to draw any conclusions till we have the kit and there are some first hand reports about it

 

[bangerblueed]

Personally i am a little dubious of both systems and will stick to my proven lenz set 100 Whilst price is a major factor in descisions on DCC I think the Hornby select has proven that you get what you pay for the lower the price the lower the spec. thats not to say that the systems don't have merit but I think that anyone starting out with the cheaper sytems will at some point have to upgrade if they then want to explore the possibilities that DCC offers

 

[mthornton]

QUOTE (bangerblueed @ 26 Jan 2007, 20:39) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>the lower the price the lower the spec.
Except that these cheaper systems offer something that Lenz does not (at least under their own name) --- a modern user interface.

 

[Oakydoke]

A modern user interface is the next step up for DCC.

Established manufacturers have been slow to update their systems in this regard.

Lenz have provided it on the Roco MultiMaus, but we've yet to see what they have planned for their next generation systems and controllers.

It seems the Dynamis will do all a £250 system will do as well!

I can't wait!

 

[Oakydoke]

QUOTE (Gary @ 26 Jan 2007, 19:16) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>If the whole Dynamis system is £90 then it is an absolute bargain. .........The wireless technology seems to be associated with a Pro package and that price has yet to be revealed so the actual package with everything may be more. Does anybody know any different on this?

Happy modelling
Gary
No, the Dynamis handset/console is Wireless. The Pro enables you to add another 3 similar handsets to make a total of 4.
Add another wireless module and there is scope for further 4. At least that's the way it reads to me?

The Pro also allows you to connect up to 128 devices which may include further wired handets.

£90 rrp may end up as £75 at the store?
As we don't know how much a Dynamis Pro will cost, or a Pro box, my guess is that the announced price is a marketing device to stall potential buyers from opting for the Hornby Elite when it arrives sometime this spring???

 

[Doug]

See the spec so far on the Dynamis here.

It does look promising indeed.

 

[nzpaul]

I've got an advanced order in for the Elite unit and providing it does what Hornby say it will I'll be a happy chap. The Dynamis' spec sheet suggests that it will be the superior piece of kit, especially regarding it's address memory, 9999 vs 256 for Elite.But the "built to be handled by 5 year olds" look of the Elite seems a little more friendly than the Dynamis' more tecno wizz appearance. So I'll wait with fingers crossed that Hornby sort all the bugs out soon and I end up with a simple & reliable unit to get started in this DCC lark.
From a comparison point of view I'd imagine the less intimidating of the two will end up being the most popular,but you can never be sure of these things. For the sake of the hobby I hope both end up being completely successful from an operating & sales point of view.
Cheers
Paul

 

[neil_s_wood]

I was very surprised at how small the dynamis was. It's similar in concept to the Maerklin/Trix budget efforts which also emanated from ESU. It's hard to tell how big something is from a picture unless you have something to judge it by.

Guess now we know why it looks like a baby Ecos. If it's a good as it's daddy it's sure to get good reviews.

 

[Doug]

A note to Bachmann - who read this quite often:

Regarding your wireless connectivity. Great news, but I hope that you're not going to use 2.4 GHz and interfere with my home WiFi network.

 

[Oakydoke]

2.4 Ghz is the allocated band for most WiFi kit.
That not only includes wireless networks but TV senders that transmit TV pictures around the house, streaming audio devices that distribute internet radio, PC music files, iPod or Mp3 around the home.

I've not had a problem with multiple systems in operation; well so far!

Are DECT phones on this too?

 

[dwb]

>Are DECT phones on this too?
Yes.

Given that the OS underneath the ECoS is Linux, and the ready availability of WiFi components and software drivers, the ECoS wireless unit could use WiFi to create the link. If ESU didn't want the wireless unit to "pop up" in full view other wireless networks, then an alternative could be to use the DECT protocol. My point is that there are several communications protocols "out there" that are designed to co-exist on the 2.4GHz carrier frequency, so there shouldn't be a problem.

David

 

[Doug]

2.4 GHz is a licence free band. A few years ago it was largely empty, but now it is getting full.

I've had to change the channel of my home network a few times to maintain a good connection due to neighbours installing their networks and not knowing how to do it themselves.

If Bachmann use 2.4 GHz and if they hard-wire in the channel or sub frequency then we're going to have problems. Frequency hopping is one solution, but it is expensive. Channel selection - perhaps using DIP switches is another solution.

Zimo use 433 MHz (in Europe) which is designated as Industrial, Scientific, Medical band. Perhaps Bachmann/ESU will do the same.

For the USA, they will have to use the 900 MHz band.

 

[Dennis David]

I thought DECT was 1.8 Ghz? I've used the Marklin Mobile Station and it's very nice to hold in your hand so Dynamis might just have a winner here. I wonder what ECoS will come up with to justify what I am sure will be a wireless handset at a higher price.

Oh ... and come on Uhlenbrock, Fleischmann & Lenz the ball is in your court.

 

[mthornton]

QUOTE (Doug @ 27 Jan 2007, 13:02) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>2.4 GHz is a licence free band. A few years ago it was largely empty, but now it is getting full.
The same appears to be true of all the 'free' bands. We have an audio sender that operates at 868MHz (another ISM band) and that doesn't work as well now as it once did. Regardless of which band is chosen, a simple transmission protocol isn't going to work well. Fortunately the cost of channel hopping/ wide band techniques has come down. Manual selection of channel would be frustrating and should be unnecessary these days.

 

[dwb]

>I've had to change the channel of my home network a few times to maintain a good connection due to neighbours installing their networks and not knowing how to do it themselves.

A colleague at work has WiFi problems at home which they think are due to a neighbour's wireless alarm system - ie the kind where the sensors are battery powered and use wireless to talk to the central box. They think their signal is being "swamped" by the alarm system.

David

 

[Doug]

You can see how the channels of this 2.4 GHz band overlap and can cause interference.

We have 13 available channels here in Europe and it is best to use Channel 1, 7 and 13 if there are multiple networks in the same area. Anything crossing your signal is going to impede the quality of the signal and cause a slowdown and or data loss.

 

[rb277170]

Not sure which one will come out on top however:-

Bachmann . Had E-Z DCC out for 2 years now. I believe using Lenz technology. NMRA compatible. No major issues on introduction. Have developed a range of Diesel sound locos . Have declared their ambitions to develop DCC while not leaving out Analogue users.

Hornby. Select unit out from November. Entirely new design using a third party company. Not NMRA compliant (no certificate) but stated to be built to NMRA standards and Elite unit being tested now. Significant problems in Select unit being able to program other decoders. R8215 decoder very low spec- some reports of it not having enough amps to start some existing Hornby locomotives. Hornby announce new Sapphire decoder. Hornby badly botched introduction of DCC declaring all new locos DCC Fitted (they thought they would run on DC) and ignoring their analogue users. Had to subsequently reverse decision and state locos would be made in DC and DCC versions.

So haven't seen Dynamis or Elite units so far , but which coompany has better track record so far.........

Russell

 

[Gary]

I have come away from the London Toy Fair very impressed with both units. I would suggest that others who have visited the London Toy Fair will have been equally impressed.

Dynamis is wireless and Elite has a computer and internet interface built into its basic spec which enables you to use Railroad and other PC software and to accept downloads.

Elite does enable you to control the speed of 2 independent locomotives concurently and definitely has 4 digit addressing and can definitely read addresses as well as write.

Dynamis is a 100% British concept and has had absolutely no input from Bachmann USA. Bachmann USA are interested in offering the product for sale within the USA.

They are two entirely different products with different capabilities.

Both products are state of the art with one based around ESU concepts and one based around Lenz concepts. With an appropriate adapter and providing you purchase a Dynamis Pro unit both should be able to talk to each other and operate alongside each other!

Happy modelling
Gary