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Does anyone know which numbers are in which livery? I have the older Mainline version in SR green numbered S1717. However it is labelled 'Buffet Restaurant Car" and seems to have a slightly different arrangement of windows. Is this in fact the same sort of coach at all? It rides on commonwealth bogies.

Sorry for the slightly confused question. I guess what I am really asking the assembed experts is

a) Are any of these new RMB's suitable for a BR/SR layout placed around the mid 1958 era, and what livery (green or maroon) would be correct?

What was the prototype of the Mainline S1717 in green that I already have?

Thanks for any enlightenment....

Norm
 

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David

Thanks for your reply with the useful links. By following that and some additional research I came up with this useful link for BR/SR modellers

http://www.cometmodels.co.uk/comet/admin/d...allocations.PDF

From that page it would appear that there is another MK 1 Buffet car designation RB - as opposed to RMB and these are numbered in the 17xx range. It would appear to be one of these that the earlier Replica/Mainline model depicts. The new RMB models are numbered in the 18xx range

It would appear that by including a green RB or RMB in any train on my 1958 based SR layout I am treading on VERY thin ice, as the first of these vehicles was just being built at that point, and at this period the correct catering car would have been a Maunsell Buffet. Problem is that Hornby seem to have left that type off their list
Oh well, I will have to dust off my modellers license and pretend they were built in 1956 or so which is the earliest date they would have been painted green from new.

Question: Does anyone have information or links to share which would explain the difference between a MK 1 RB and and RMB?? Certainly the exterior and window treatment is quite different

Norm
 

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< Source:- British Railways Mark 1 Coaches Keith Parkin Pendragon HMRS 1994/1999 ISBN 1 899816 07 0

Mike
many thanks for this reference and the reply. It gets clearer now. the RB which is the prototype of my older Replica/Bachmann model has a Kitchen and seating bays at only one end of the coach. The RMB has a central kitchen/Buffet section (much smaller) and seating bays each end

Interesting!!! And until recently all MK 1 restaurant cars looked the same to me.

My basic problem remains. Since these vehicles weren't constructed until just after my modelling period what SHOULD I use with Bulleid and (soon) Maunsell coaches. I know there are Bulleid 'tavern' cars and there was a reference to Maunsell Buffet cars in the link to cometmodels that I posted... Meantime I am going to dust off the modellers license since the RB and RMB are nice looking models and fit the bill ;!

Cheers
Norm
 

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Sounds as though we are in the same situation David! I don't have my copy of Model Rail yet. Just took out a subscription and this issue is supposedly on its way to me in New Jersey. I'll look forward to reading that article.

Meantime tried to order a green RMB from Hattons this afternoon. 6 in stock when I placed my order. 5 in stock after I placed my order - so far so good. Then got the 'order picked' email and no RMB


Anyway, this education on catering vehicles is getting quite interesting.

On a related topic: (both green and Southern Region) Has anyone noticed that all the retailers are listing an additional FIVE Hornby King Arthur's for 2007, but that Hornby themselves are not (or I have missed the listing). Since one of these is a very old favorite - number 30755 'The Red Knight' I am really hoping they are being produced. The 'knight' is one of the few 'Arthurs with the LeMaitre double chimney and in it's day was apparently extremely well regarded by the shedmaster at Nine Elms, who conspired to keep it allocated to his shed for many years.

Norm
 

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David

my Model Rail arrived yesterday and the first thing I read was the article you refer to. You are right, it was extremely informative and there is a lot to know!

The two things I took away immediately were 1) Both my Replica RB, and the soon to arrive green RMB are suitable for use as the sole catering vehicle on a train, even though in real life they would most likely be paired with an First or Second open car, and 2) as I've mentioned before I shouldn't even be running them on my supposedly mid 1958 based layout.

I like the models and so I'm just going to pretend they were built in the mid 50's. Come to think of it, that would give me an excuse to get the carmine and cream RMB..... Hmmm

Norm
 

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Firstly, thanks to 60134 for confirmation on hornby's forthcoming 'The Red Knight' There has been correspondence on the SEMG yahoo group on this topic as well and contributors there are hoping Hornby does it properly with the almost unique vertical smoke deflectors and the large LeMaitre double chimney

The main point of this post was to take up the point Dave made about running things 'out of period'. I was curious what other modellers do when a prototype you like just doesn't fit with your chosen era. David makes a couple of good suggestions such as 'showcase a favourite train over a period of years'. What do other people do. My own approach is a somewhat simple one - simply stretch introduction and withdrawal dates by around five years. In this way I can justify running a loco such as 'The Red Knight' withdrawn around 1955 if I recall correctly, with green Mk1 RMB's which appeared in the early sixties. I do try and keep road vehicles 'period appropriate', so no Mini's or MGB's, etc on my layout. If you want a sports car it has to be a Jag XK !!

My 'Five Year plan' isn't a bad approach, as often, especially with withdrawals in this era, they were caused by a failure that under different conditions would have been repaired and the loco staying in service, perhaps through one more major overhaul. I do steer clear of most diesels as my premise is 'Steam was more valuable than real life history'. That said, I am considering fitting sound to my Bachmann 08's and 04;)))) - and yes, all my diesel shunters have 5 digit numbers - 13365, 13029 and 11226. If any manufacturers are listening, I'd LOVE a model of one of the diesel pioneers such as 10000/1 or 10800

Cheers
Norm
 

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>so no Mini's
Ah, not even one of the first off the production line in September 1959?

Fraid not David. That was the point I was trying to make. I keep the actual layout - buildings, road signs, road traffic, road, station and advertising signs as period authentic to mid 1958 as possible so that the overall 'feel' is correct, and then play fast and loose with locomotive and rolling stock dates within my self imposed 5 year plus or minus window.

This way I find the overall appearance of the layout is 'authentic to the eye' (if not the critics
)

Why 1958 ?? This was largely due to the fact that I can't be bothered to keep changing all the BR totems to either early or late versions. 1958 allows me to have about a 50/50 mix of both

This is why I can't even justify Mini prototype #1 on the layout...

The last trick on dates that I resort to is that even if a locomotive is withdrawn, it is not necessarily scrapped, and might be pressed into one last service on an enthusiast special, or shown at a works open day.

Does anyone else agree that it would be really useful for model car, truck and bus suppliers to provide information on year of introduction for their models? Hattons do supply some information in some cases, but I find I often have to Google phrases like 'Austin J2' to see if I can buy a particular model.

the replies to this topic (now way off topic) have been interesting - some would probably say I am too obsessed with keeping everything in period, but I find it is all down to that subjective feeling that the layout looks 'right'

Cheers
Norm
 
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