[Gary]

The blanket withdrawal of any contact by Bachmann with the online community does make one think that Bachmann put no value on the internet as a communications channel.

And to be blunt rmweb has little value in its current form so it would be understandable if support to that site was withdrawn by Bachmann until changes are made. They have managed to upset Hornby's Simon Kohler on many an occasion and he won't communicate with that site. And their members constantly bitch about Pat Hammond's mremag and even MRF at times and so it can get personal. There were personal comments made about the Bachmann representative that went unmoderated. What has any of this to do with model railways?

I'm being pretty hard talking here but I feel very angry about the whole situation as my efforts to build bridges to date may have been in vain all becuase of the ill considered remarks of others on a site where the moderators seem to have lost control of the loose cannons.

Look folks, you simply cannot say what you like in a public place!

And to be fair Model Rail Forum members do realise this so well done!

You make moderation simple!

Loosely moderated and destructive sites time and time again set back the efforts of those constructive websites who are genuinely making efforts to build a rapore between their members/visitors and the manufacturers.

Lets hope its not too late to repair the damage.

Happy modelling
Gary

 

[Gary]

QUOTE Gary, I have faced similar frustrations that Bachmann do not view any internet forums more postively, can I remind you that

Bachmann on the face of the evidence are not the villains here and its a bit unfair to imply that they are.

QUOTE .....feel that it is unnecessary to make rmweb the villain of the piece

Would we have had an email from Bachmann if it had been a MRF or mremag discussion?

I don't know but if Bachmann were thinking about this move anyway then they needed a catalyst or an excuse.

Andy. I'm not saying we are holier than thou however Doug, Pat and myself have years of experiance of working with manufacturers and we believe we understand when to draw the line although I agree it can be a fine line at times!

And again we will hand it to our members when we say that they appear to know aswell.

Doug has reminded me that we are in a holiday period and his idea of more moderator cover is a good one.

Happy modelling
Gary

 

[Gary]

We need to find out from Bachmann what their concerns are and then take action to address these concerns. These concerns are very likely linked in some way to the thoughts expressed below.

When reviewing a new model the paper based magazines normally make the same observations that are made among the online community. Copy deadlines normally dictate that reviews are prepared before the models appear at stockists and so magazine reviewers cannot be influenced by the observations of the online community.

So if something is innacurate it gets picked up whatever.

Bachmann, Hornby, Dapol, Peco and everybody else enjoy the same scrutiny of all new products.

Therefore is does seem odd that a company should favour one medium of communication over another.

However the online community does contain its fair share of armchair critics who want to make a name for themselves and who get a kick out of winding things up a knotch. They hide behind the cloak of anonimity.

This is something that a paper based magazine cannot do.

I suspect it is this lack of accountability for their actions among the members of the online community that is of concern to Bachmann, and probably others.

So how can these concerns be addressed?

Happy modelling
Gary

 

[Gary]

Thinking about all this does anybody know exactly what support Bachmann actually gave the online community?

In terms of news (free publicity) they would circulate files by email so all they need to do is remove a few email addresses from their mailing list. The Bachmann workload does not change.

And they made observations and would respond where they considered it to be appropriate (again by email presumably?). They might argue that this gives a website credibility and that we should doff our station masters caps in gratitude. However any model manufacturer worth their salt should monitor the relevant online communities and react when it is appropriate. Even if its just an invite to contact the model company directly. Bachmann will no longer do this!

And Bachmann issued an annual New Year press pack upon request at the London Toy Fair providing free publicity when the information was published but also forcing the authors of any online report to give up a lot of free time as their info was not that web friendly and had to be formatted.

Bachmann don't actually part with any cash or sponsor any site or provide review samples or competition prizes to any member of the online community as far as I am aware.

Hornby do!

To be blunt is it such a big deal?

So it seems its very much their loss and probably Hornby's gain!

What do you say folks?

A total Bachmann PR disaster?

Happy modelling
Gary

 

[Gary]

QUOTE All forums do get a little heated sometimes (this one included) but i am very glad that we have a forum that can usually have a civilised debate on a wide range of subjects.

I think the mods at MRF lean towards keeping things on topic and are not overkeen on waffle and idle chit chit loosely termed as banter as this makes moderating life more complicated than it need be. Ok, MRF may be seen by some as a little bit on the serious side as a result however this reduces the risks of offending any visitor who may be looking in.

Happy modelling
Gary

PS Just out of interest Pedro how did your trip to China go? Is it worth a seperate thread or was it not eventful from a railway point of view?

 

[Gary]

Lets face it rmweb is not about to vanish into thin air any more than MRF and mremag. Each site has its own format and style which allow their members and contributors to interact.

If we use the paper press as an analogy.

mremag has a "Railway Modeller" style (strong on the club and society and prototype side)

MRF has a "Model Rail" style (strong on the DCC, "How to..." and international side)

rmweb has a "British Railway Modelling" style (strong on the British model locomotive and rolling stock side)

Its nice to know that Hornby are still happy to provide feedback to the online community, having noted Simon Kohlers "We have the pictures!" comment at mremag today in connection with the M7 lining debate.

Happy modelling
Gary

 

[Gary]

Bachmann withdraws support for online publications and yet right now there are 5 Bachmann stories and nil Hornby stories under discussion on page 1 of the list of Model Rail Forum news topics.

All this free publicity.

Almost 4500 views in 5 topics reinforcing the Bachmann brand at no cost to Bachmann.

Silly boys!

Happy modelling
Gary

 

[Gary]

I agree with Dennis.

This thread has gone off topic and we are no longer discussing Bachmann's support for website based publications.

The place to discuss the rights and wrongs of Bachmann production is in the forum/website whose members and visitors wish to make an issue out of such things in a manner which has caused Bachmann to take the action that they have taken.

Right now it seems that this thread is being slowly hijacked by stealth by those who wish to push their own agendas.

Model Rail Forum does wish to development relationships with all manufacturers. If other websites do not want to develop similiar relationships then that is up to them and their site owners. All that we ask of Bachmann is that when Bachmann consider if it is worthwhile developing a relationship with the online community that they consider each website on its own merits rather than taking a broad general view resulting from the missguided actions of a few on one or two websites.

Happy modelling
Gary

 

[Gary]

The marketing budget for Hornby and Bachmann is astronomical. Hornby are giving away £5000 in prizes in Model Rail at the moment and each of the colour full page adverts that they have each month on either the inside cover or back cover are probably around £800 (£10000 per year per magazine).

And then they spend a fortune on their own websites and catalogues!

In the context of this massive spend it does seem a bit odd that they are only prepared to spend maybe £100 to £200 each year at most if they spend any at all sponsoring sites that are enjoyed by the growing online community who support the hobby.

Think about the Hornby and Bachmann 2006 news stories at Model Rail Forum. The general consensous was that the presentation at MRF was rather better than that of both Hornby and Bachmann!

Happy modelling
Gary