Lone Star offered the 'Baby Deltic' - 10 in class, very short service life - in the Treble-O-Lectric range, back in the 1960's. It had all-wheel drive too, something not seen in OO RTR for another 30 years! There was a very good collector exhibition, local to the original factory site in Hatfield, held about two years ago.
Class size & length of service
With Hejan having a seemingly successful prototype modelled, I've been thinking, (Yes it did hurt) what is the smallest class size and shortest lived class to have been produced RTR and therefore what may be considered in the future?
The smallest RTR diesel I can think of off the top of my head would be Hornbys class 29 with only 20 being built and as far as I know 2 liveries worn. I like these locos and have one on my layout so I think I would go for a "Bells & Whistles" versoin if anyone was to produce a new one.
On the steam front I can't think of a smaller class having been produced than the Princess Royals with only 12 (not counting the Turbomotive) though this class has the benifit of long service, toplink duties and a wealth of liveries.
The smallest RTR diesel I can think of off the top of my head would be Hornbys class 29 with only 20 being built and as far as I know 2 liveries worn. I like these locos and have one on my layout so I think I would go for a "Bells & Whistles" versoin if anyone was to produce a new one.
On the steam front I can't think of a smaller class having been produced than the Princess Royals with only 12 (not counting the Turbomotive) though this class has the benifit of long service, toplink duties and a wealth of liveries.
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Hornby Dublo did a very poor version of the infamous Metrovick co-bo class 28. 20 in the class, one miraculously preserved after spending years as a carriage heating unit (D5705).
There were two variants - as built and with the later revised cabs. I forget the length of service but I think it was about 10 years. One of the class even made it into rail blue!
One for Heljan?
And, just for electric (?) modellers one of the early WCML classes only had a few members (was it the 83?) One of them made it into intercity swallow livery!
Regards
There were two variants - as built and with the later revised cabs. I forget the length of service but I think it was about 10 years. One of the class even made it into rail blue!
One for Heljan?
And, just for electric (?) modellers one of the early WCML classes only had a few members (was it the 83?) One of them made it into intercity swallow livery!
Regards
QUOTE (BRITHO @ 19 Dec 2007, 17:01) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>And, just for electric (?) modellers one of the early WCML classes only had a few members (was it the 83?) One of them made it into intercity swallow livery!
Regards
Hi Britho, speaking of electrics the "Badger" seems to have a bit of a cult following could be done in the same way Falcon has. Though there's only two liveries this time unless you count some of those done by the custodians on Fictitious Liveries.
For those of you that haven't seen it yet this site is great, full of what might have beens.
http://fictitiousliveries.fotopic.net/
Regards
Hi Britho, speaking of electrics the "Badger" seems to have a bit of a cult following could be done in the same way Falcon has. Though there's only two liveries this time unless you count some of those done by the custodians on Fictitious Liveries.
For those of you that haven't seen it yet this site is great, full of what might have beens.
http://fictitiousliveries.fotopic.net/
QUOTE (5696Arethusa @ 19 Dec 2007, 10:55) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>On the steam front I can't think of a smaller class having been produced than the Princess Royals with only 12 (not counting the Turbomotive) though this class has the benifit of long service, toplink duties and a wealth of liveries.
The Triang/Hornby Caledonian single was a class of one- it does share the same advantages of the Princess though- long service (1886-1935), toplink duties and 3 livery choices
The Triang/Hornby Caledonian single was a class of one- it does share the same advantages of the Princess though- long service (1886-1935), toplink duties and 3 livery choices
I suspect that the steam locomotive with the smallest class size and shortest life was the GWR Holden 0-4-0 tank, as immortalised by Hornby and reproduced by the thousand. Only one built, in 1902, and, I believe, scrapped in 1911, and only really worked inside Swindon works.
QUOTE (5696Arethusa @ 19 Dec 2007, 19:55) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>With Hejan having a seemingly successful prototype modelled, I've been thinking, (Yes it did hurt) what is the smallest class size and shortest lived class to have been produced RTR and therefore what may be considered in the future?
The smallest RTR diesel I can think of off the top of my head would be Hornbys class 29 with only 20 being built and as far as I know 2 liveries worn. I like these locos and have one on my layout so I think I would go for a "Bells & Whistles" versoin if anyone was to produce a new one.
On the steam front I can't think of a smaller class having been produced than the Princess Royals with only 12 (not counting the Turbomotive) though this class has the benifit of long service, toplink duties and a wealth of liveries.
***As a prototype of note in the diesels I'd have to say LMS10000 and 10001 would be ideal - first mainline diesel to take a named train regularly (I think) taking Euston to Carlisle trains and also often out of St Pancras .... Often run as a pair so H or B can sell twin packs as well as each of them, lots of character and a big loco to boot so would appeal to many. They even ran together with one in LMS and one in BR loco/black livery.
Liveries include LMS, Early BR on black and BR green. They ran over a wide part of the LMS and LMR regions and did service on the Southern out of Nine Elms 1953 to 1955 and then wandered again.
Much of their EE running gear formed the basis for the class 40 and 50 so they have a historical edge too....
As for Steam....
I still want an outside frame Kirtley - full of character with lots of possible detail variants and several livery possibilities from Midland Gren, midland Lake, LMS, Br etc etc... Ran almost everywhere from pre-grouping until well into BR days - even exported and also used by the WD in WW1.
Richard
The smallest RTR diesel I can think of off the top of my head would be Hornbys class 29 with only 20 being built and as far as I know 2 liveries worn. I like these locos and have one on my layout so I think I would go for a "Bells & Whistles" versoin if anyone was to produce a new one.
On the steam front I can't think of a smaller class having been produced than the Princess Royals with only 12 (not counting the Turbomotive) though this class has the benifit of long service, toplink duties and a wealth of liveries.
***As a prototype of note in the diesels I'd have to say LMS10000 and 10001 would be ideal - first mainline diesel to take a named train regularly (I think) taking Euston to Carlisle trains and also often out of St Pancras .... Often run as a pair so H or B can sell twin packs as well as each of them, lots of character and a big loco to boot so would appeal to many. They even ran together with one in LMS and one in BR loco/black livery.
Liveries include LMS, Early BR on black and BR green. They ran over a wide part of the LMS and LMR regions and did service on the Southern out of Nine Elms 1953 to 1955 and then wandered again.
Much of their EE running gear formed the basis for the class 40 and 50 so they have a historical edge too....
As for Steam....
I still want an outside frame Kirtley - full of character with lots of possible detail variants and several livery possibilities from Midland Gren, midland Lake, LMS, Br etc etc... Ran almost everywhere from pre-grouping until well into BR days - even exported and also used by the WD in WW1.
Richard
QUOTE (5696Arethusa @ 19 Dec 2007, 10:55) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>With Heljan having a seemingly successful prototype modelled, I've been thinking, (Yes it did hurt) what is the smallest class size and shortest lived class to have been produced RTR and therefore what may be considered in the future?
And with the NRM/Bach DP1, and Murphy/Bach 141, giving every indication of similar success, the door looks to be open for any twin bogie type that has a reasonable following. Richard's suggestion of the LMS 'twins' would be likely winners (the market cannot be saturated with the FiaTrains brass offering), DP2, Lion, Kestrel, the 1st gen Bo-Bo diesel failures various, the 1st gen AC electrics...
But exciting as this prospect may be, won't 'somebody' do the HST power cars to current standards first?
And with the NRM/Bach DP1, and Murphy/Bach 141, giving every indication of similar success, the door looks to be open for any twin bogie type that has a reasonable following. Richard's suggestion of the LMS 'twins' would be likely winners (the market cannot be saturated with the FiaTrains brass offering), DP2, Lion, Kestrel, the 1st gen Bo-Bo diesel failures various, the 1st gen AC electrics...
But exciting as this prospect may be, won't 'somebody' do the HST power cars to current standards first?
Thee's a common factor to most of the small shortlived classes mentioned - they come from that melancholy sector of the RTR market "Cancelled Futures". These are the ones where a manufacturer tooled up the latest loco to invest in the future only to discover that BR had cancelled the future in question....
Thus the Hornby Dublo Co-Bo , and the Lone Star Baby Deltic were representing the latest modern traction when they came out . Unfortunately they'd put their money on horses that fell at an early fence in the Type 2 Grand National. Triang picked the Brush loco as their entry in the Type 2 Stakes and struck lucky.
Triang weren't always so lucky. When they launched EM2 it was a glamourous modern express loco on the latest most high profile mainline electric railway. Unfortunately BR went for 25kV AC not 1500V DC. The Blue Pullman was a near miss - state of the art at the time, but not that long lived and it didn't develop into a common type
Hornby came another cropper 20 years on with the APT
In all these cases , they didn't realise they were tooling up a shortlived loco with few in the class and a limited geographical range: they thought they were investing in the future
Deliberately releasing a loco you know was a small short lived class is different. The Hornby "29" is actually a bit of a hybrid between the unrebuilt 22 and rebuilt 29 , and there were nearly 60 NBL Type 2 diesel electrics built originally . It was still a pretty surprising choice, even though they also worked briefly on GN suburban work and in E Anglia
We should certainly get new HST power cars before we get any new AC electrics - but I'm not holding my breath for either. When there seems to be little or no interest in retooling the 86 (100 locos, 40+ years service life, wide range, lots of liveries) and there's no 87 , I doubt we will see first generation AC electrics or the 89 in the foreseable future
Thus the Hornby Dublo Co-Bo , and the Lone Star Baby Deltic were representing the latest modern traction when they came out . Unfortunately they'd put their money on horses that fell at an early fence in the Type 2 Grand National. Triang picked the Brush loco as their entry in the Type 2 Stakes and struck lucky.
Triang weren't always so lucky. When they launched EM2 it was a glamourous modern express loco on the latest most high profile mainline electric railway. Unfortunately BR went for 25kV AC not 1500V DC. The Blue Pullman was a near miss - state of the art at the time, but not that long lived and it didn't develop into a common type
Hornby came another cropper 20 years on with the APT
In all these cases , they didn't realise they were tooling up a shortlived loco with few in the class and a limited geographical range: they thought they were investing in the future
Deliberately releasing a loco you know was a small short lived class is different. The Hornby "29" is actually a bit of a hybrid between the unrebuilt 22 and rebuilt 29 , and there were nearly 60 NBL Type 2 diesel electrics built originally . It was still a pretty surprising choice, even though they also worked briefly on GN suburban work and in E Anglia
We should certainly get new HST power cars before we get any new AC electrics - but I'm not holding my breath for either. When there seems to be little or no interest in retooling the 86 (100 locos, 40+ years service life, wide range, lots of liveries) and there's no 87 , I doubt we will see first generation AC electrics or the 89 in the foreseable future
1 - 9 of 9 Posts
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