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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am not convinced by what I have seen or read that DCC is a viable alternative to analogue.
I have just bought a Roco AC2000 Electronic controller, which has the best control I have found of all the types I have used so far. SUPERB!
Now that I am moving and will need to rewire my Layout, can anyone convince me to change?
Your thoughts please.

All the best


David
 

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Hi David...

In Spain the majority of layouts that i know, have the rolling stock in digital and the layout (points, lights, etc) in analogue. All of advantages of the digital world in your locos and the manual control funny in your layout


Regards from Spain,
Oscar
 

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I would be inclined to agree with Oscar - DCC for traction & analogue for accessories.

Some of the advantages for DCC;
Lights can be left on stationary locos and/or stock - no going brighter & dimmer as speed increases/decreases.
Coach lighting stays on all the time (can be switched off via decoder).
Sound.
Full power available for smoke generators at low speeds.
Real remote uncoupling using Kroiss couplings.
Ability to set one or more trainsrunning on main lines while you manually control others, using just the one controller.
Easy ability to set up automatic block working for main lines with trains always stopping in the exact place (only with the better quality decoders).
Fairly easy ability to use a computer for control. Feedback modules available so that the computer "knows" where each locomotive is.
You can of course use DCC for controlling signals & points if you wish.

In a nutshell, DCC can be as easy or complicated as you wish.

Hope this helps.
 

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QUOTE (dbclass50 @ 13 Jul 2007, 04:05) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I would be inclined to agree with Oscar - DCC for traction & analogue for accessories.

Some of the advantages for DCC;
Lights can be left on stationary locos and/or stock - no going brighter & dimmer as speed increases/decreases.
Coach lighting stays on all the time (can be switched off via decoder).
Sound.
Full power available for smoke generators at low speeds.
Real remote uncoupling using Kroiss couplings.
Ability to set one or more trainsrunning on main lines while you manually control others, using just the one controller.
Easy ability to set up automatic block working for main lines with trains always stopping in the exact place (only with the better quality decoders).
Fairly easy ability to use a computer for control. Feedback modules available so that the computer "knows" where each locomotive is.
You can of course use DCC for controlling signals & points if you wish.

In a nutshell, DCC can be as easy or complicated as you wish.

Hope this helps.
I would echo all of the above. I really don't think analogue is a real option anymore. Do you have a black and white TV or betamax video? I would put analogue DC in the same basket.
 

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Adding to the exposed by Brian and Neil, the wiring will be more easy than an analogue layout.

In the basics, you only need two wires to control all the locomotives. You only have to isolate sectors in the case that you need more than one booster (one per sector).

The digital control makes the layout traffic more realistic. Not only with the lights on the locomotives. You can add a BM1 module by lenz in the signal lights (or semaphores.... I don't know where the correct expression in english). With the BM1, when the red light is on, it is generated a signal that the locomotive decoder starts a deceleration to stop within a desired section of line (only with gold and silver lenz decoders or anyone that supports the ABC signals). This is a little example......

Regards from Spain,
Oscar
 

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I cannot imagine going back to analogue.

The ease of wiring and operation without having to worry about seperating locos in block sections to control them is great. I have a large loco depot on my layout and can park 25 locos next to each other and can control any of them independantly wherever they are on the track.

Also the fine tuning of the performance characteristics by programming the cv values in the devoders is very useful.

David, its time to change and the relocation of your layout makes a good time to take the plunge.

David
 

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I think you may have to think long and hard about what you need on your layout as no one is the same
at this time I'm modeling a RhB layout in HOm which I'll not be running on DCC as BEMO seem to have a number
of funny idea's on how to fit a chip anyway back to your problem I've modeled in 0n30 00 and HO where I've used DCC
and it worked well but I've also had to put a number of very nice but old loco's to one side due to not been able to find a way to fit a chip and yes you can run one unfitted loco at a time on a DCC layout but it will drive you mad
sorry to go on but once I start!!!!!
 

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Fit a decoder in some locos, are hard but not impossible. You can buy a very, very small decoders. Some can be fitted in a z scale locomotives (not in all of course).

Now i'm working to fit a ct electronic decoder into a small shunting loco. The heavy work are to cut to part of the chassis and electronic circuit to fit it.


Best regards from Spain,
Oscar
 

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I´m currently converting to digital, and I based my decision on how easy my engines could be converted.

If they have a DCC socket: piece of cake.

If not: select your engine from the list and click for more instructions.

I have one engine that requires milling some of the ballast to fit the decoder. %§$?'#!!!! (nasty German curses) However, a friend will help me with it after his summer vacation. Phew...
 

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Yes I would like to run my HOm layout on DCC but how would I put a chip in sonething like a Bemo 2/2
tractor unit which is around 2" long and if you ever need a good laugh try and fit a chip to a split chassis loco
now that is fun I hope I'm not high jacking your tread but if anyone has any info on fitting DCC to BEMO locos
I may change my mind
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
William,

Not at all,I want to hear all the plus's and the negative.
My main problem is a large fleet of kit built loco's,are they convertable

The modeltorque motors can be used on my Fleischmann loco's for DCC,

Marklin Hamo

And the all important question,how much will it cost

Please keep your advice coming


All the best,

David
 

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All the locos are convertibles to digital. Any of my locos have Nem socket for the decoder. If you know how to solder 4 wires you can digitalize the loco. The big problem is the space to fit the decoder


The cost? it depends. I recommend to you maintain the layout in analogue and digitize the locos little by little (sorry, but any expressions are difficult to translate to me). Hornby and bachman have a low cost decoders mades by lenz.

In the digital control in spain we have the idea of we need a very big central (great donkey, walks or it does not walk). In my modest opinion, with a multimouse by roco, Bachmann dinamys or hornby elite it is sufficient and are good options. I have a Bachmann EZ-Command and i'm very happy with it.

Best regards from Spain,
Oscar
 

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Rubi is right in a way if your changeing a layout from DC to DCC the last thing you do is the wireing in as much
as you can run your chipped loco's without a problem on your DC layout while you change over as for buying chip's
you pay for what you get this is only me saying this but if I was starting over with DCC I would use Lenz chips
and a Lenz system I use a Digitrax system which is very good but has things on it I'll never use I've used both BACHMANN
and HORNBY chip's and again this is only my view on this but I've never been able to get a HORNBY chip to work right
the new ones are I'm told a little better but sorry not for me the BACHMANN EZ and above are not to bad but
as I said before you get what you pay for

are we all thinking how I'm to fit a chip in to my BEMO 2/2 ?????
 

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Hi David

On your kitbuilt locos - from my experience they have been the easiest locos of all to convert to DCC because they all seem to have more room to fit the chip. The kitbuilt locos are white metal and dont have ballast weights taking up all the space; and in many cases they don't have lights to worry about.

For the DJH locos, even the very small ones; the installation is really easy.

And the locos fitted with Loksound chips are really excellent.

As far as control of points - I'm less convinced. I use digital but I'm not sure there is much benefit over an analogue panel unless you are going for full computer control.

On the chips, I have been pleasantly surprised at the results from the Hornby chips. I'd read so many negative things but I'e installed 4 of them now and they work fine. In fact I've had more problems with the Bachmann chips than the Hornby ones. Control is by LEnz LH100 units.

Hope this rambling reply helps.

David
 

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QUOTE (william @ 17 Jul 2007, 00:02) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So anyone have any advice about BEMO chipping yet


Hi William

its been a few years since I dabbled with Bemo stuff.. I dcc'd a Tm 2/2 tracktor, so I hope this helps.

As I recall, you will have to accept that due to the tiny size of the cabin. the decoder will be visible.
At the time I used a small footprint Zimo Mx63 decoder clearly any small /tiny decoder will do.

As none of the Bemo Tm 2/2's have any lights there are literally only 4 wires to connect.
Remove the original circuit board ( keep it safe, should you ever want to reconvert and sell)
All you need to do is identify the wheel pick ups, 1 each side and the motor connection. & then solder each respective wire from decoder in its correct place.

I then used some black electrical tape to disguise the decoder a little.

The Bemo Tracktors only have a poor 3 pole motor but run okay,,, I found I had to add some weight to get mine to ride the points successfully. this is easy done adding a small toolbox with some micro lead shot in to the front platform.

They are cute little models and any station /goods scene really needs one !

Hope this helps.. good luck

Steve B


ps
the bigger locos are "claimed" to be dcc ready... I really don't know how they get away with that claim under trade descriptions. !

Again, you will need to cut out the circuit boards and hard wire a decoder to the respective terminals on the board... not exactly "dcc ready" as they claim!
 

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Regarding decoder fitting in kit builds, these can be among the easiest 'not DCC ready' types to convert, as they have simple wiring and usually plenty of space inside the white metal body. Some RTR requires a fair amount of work to cut away metal and/or plastic to create a concealed decoder location. But the enhanced control and operational freedom make it well worthwhile. Both the really simple stuff like dividing a train using two locos, and stabling locos 'anywhere', with no need to think about sections; and the ability to have speed matching, speed curves, acceleration and braking rates set loco by loco, and quickly altered by programming on main. Then there are the automation possibilities so that the system can run the whole layout; or act as 'the rest of the line', operating a storage yard by dispatching and receiving for example.

Thoughts.

Research system capability against your present and likely future requirements before committing to any purchase.

Try out the various styles of handsets and control interfaces available, to see which one really suits you. There is now a very large choice over a range of aspects: units suitable for desk top or panel mounted use, walkaround handsets both corded and cordless; control by turning a knob and/or pushing buttons; minimal user information from a small LCD panel, up to a fair sized screen full of information. Take the time to read the manual of the systems that appeal to you; is the information easily comprehended?

Standardise on a single system with a good reputation for reliability and performance during your learning phase, to minimise problems.

If you do take the plunge, spend a lot of time just using the system with the manual to hand until all the control actions and programming become second nature. Like driving a car, it is most enjoyable when 'unconcious competence' is achieved.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
If I want on board sound
Is there a way I can sample the sounds on line

I am looking for the whole range of available DB locos Epoch III.Steam etc.........

Thanks.

David
 
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