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I/we ALWAYS made a point of dropping folk off where they wanted....within reason......helped them realise how very much more ''convenient' the bus was?

Not any more, alas....this ws in the days of teh NBC and the 10 years after privatisation....
 

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dbclass50
QUOTE QUOTE(alastairq @ 24 Nov 2007, 15:14)
whilst on the topic of buses....why is it, that when today's train services collapse, and buses are run between stations...do the railcos hire the scrappiest, most untidy, scruffy old heaps they can find?

Simple - cheapest quote & you get what you pay for.

More likely to be a question of who actually has drivers and vehicles spare they can offer. The decent buses will be working the bus company's own routes for their own passengers- it's the old heaps that will stand idle and are only pressed into service as a last resort. Like when the railway ring to say they have a problem.... And if main local bus company is a part of Group A and the local franchise is operated by Group B? Will Group A fall over themselves to help?

I know of one largish bus company where I was told by a contact they were so short of drivers they simply couldn't bid for contract work. And in cases of emergency /service problems the cry from station staff is often "we've rung round but we can't get any buses..."

I'd have thought Javelins could work in multiple? So you use the next train to couple on and provide Thunderbird capability? I can't remember when I last heard of an EMU being rescued by a loco (Pendolinos aside - they don't work in multiple). Most EMU failures are for something like door problems anyway - the chances of an EMU failing completely and being immovable between stations are probably pretty low
 

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Although driver availability may be a minor issue there are plenty of agency/part time drivers around. I am reliably informed by a friend who sometimes organises replacement buses for a TOC that price indeed is the deciding factor (incidently, on the rare occasions I have used replacement buses they have always been respecable vehicles).

Don't really thing "Group A/Group B" makes much difference, in today's ecomomic climate money is money so it does not really matter whose it is.

If a company is short of drivers it means they are basically a s*** company to work for in terms of conditions or wages - good companies that employ drivers (PCV/LGV or whatever) are never short of good drivers - it all comes down to money again.

QUOTE (Ravenser @ 24 Nov 2007, 23:07) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>dbclass50
More likely to be a question of who actually has drivers and vehicles spare they can offer. The decent buses will be working the bus company's own routes for their own passengers- it's the old heaps that will stand idle and are only pressed into service as a last resort. Like when the railway ring to say they have a problem.... And if main local bus company is a part of Group A and the local franchise is operated by Group B? Will Group A fall over themselves to help?

I know of one largish bus company where I was told by a contact they were so short of drivers they simply couldn't bid for contract work. And in cases of emergency /service problems the cry from station staff is often "we've rung round but we can't get any buses..."

I'd have thought Javelins could work in multiple? So you use the next train to couple on and provide Thunderbird capability? I can't remember when I last heard of an EMU being rescued by a loco (Pendolinos aside - they don't work in multiple). Most EMU failures are for something like door problems anyway - the chances of an EMU failing completely and being immovable between stations are probably pretty low
 

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QUOTE (Ravenser @ 25 Nov 2007, 00:07) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I can't remember when I last heard of an EMU being rescued by a loco (Pendolinos aside - they don't work in multiple).
Although Pendolinos don't work in multiple, I'm sure a test was conducted where a Pendolino rescued another (simulated dead) Pendolino successfully.
I think they did this on the Lake District section of the WCML, presumably as a worst case scenario.
It happened 3 or 4 years ago and was widely reported in the Rail press at the time.
 

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QUOTE (Oakydoke @ 26 Nov 2007, 16:07) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Although Pendolinos don't work in multiple, I'm sure a test was conducted where a Pendolino rescued another (simulated dead) Pendolino successfully.
I think they did this on the Lake District section of the WCML, presumably as a worst case scenario.
It happened 3 or 4 years ago and was widely reported in the Rail press at the time.

I'm not sure on the exact location but yes, Virgin did perform a test with a Pendolino rescuing a Pendolino (Which had been filled with bottled water to simulate a normal load).
 

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And now just to add to the mix with HMG selling off/disposing of their stake in HS1 it seems that DBAG have applied to run ICE3 sets through the tunnel as a high speed service from Germany to London. This, if it goes ahead, will obviously increase use of the system and must by definition lead to an increased risk of failure. What then?

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What is obvious in our area is that rail replacement and emergency coverage work is always with smaller independent operators , never with the "big boys" from local subsiduaries of the big groups like First and National Express . I think the smaller operators tend to run vehicles bought from the big groups , so this may account for the impression given - though emergency replacement can throw up things like a signle deck coach. What's interesting is that even when the local bus company and the local franchise were divisions of the same group , the independent bus operators got all the rail replacement work - never the "inhouse" operator. However they did offer limited interavailability of rail tickets on buses - from their point of view this offered alternative service coverage and cost nothing since they would be running the local bus anyway

And from a commercial angle National Express (or whoever) may not exactly fall over themselves to give (say) Stagecoach, a rival, the sharpest quote - especially if they lost the franchise to them

I get the impression from one contact that the smaller operators may not train drivers but simply recruit/poach from larger operators who do train drivers from new. A shortage of drivers at a larger opertor may necessarily not reflect them being a rubbish company - that isn't the impression I got from the two people I know who actually drive for large local operators

BRITHO
QUOTE it seems that DBAG have applied to run ICE3 sets through the tunnel as a high speed service from Germany to London. This, if it goes ahead, will obviously increase use of the system and must by definition lead to an increased risk of failure. What then?

Being cynical, German trains don't break down , so this is not an issue... (And I remain to be convinced that DBAG has any great interest in running more than a token train to London - Continental railway administrations have generally seemed to want to obstruct and limit any expansion of through services , whether freight or passenger. I believe there was an internal political deal in Belgium to the effect that Eurostar would never run past Brussels in order to protect the owners of Antwerp airport. Lets see how/if DBAG get round that one )

More practically - is this really an issue? Do the SNCF have rescue diesels on standby along their own routes to rescue failed TGVs?? My understanding was that the "contingency plan" was the "so-called "ghost stations" - loops along the route where a train in trouble can be got out of the way and the passengers detrained , presumably into buses. There are 3 between Lille and Paris and another between Lille and Calais
 

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QUOTE in order to protect the owners of Antwerp airport.
What a quaint little place that airport is (or was when I was using it about 10 years ago). I don't think the runway was long enough for any jets so it was a turbo prop. On one occasion I did have to complete my journey by train from Brussels airport because I was half way to Heathrow when I realised that I had left my passport at home. Needless to say I missed the one direct plane and had to divert. It was doubly awkward because that was the day I was carrying a lot of test gear......

David
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 ·
QUOTE (Ravenser @ 26 Nov 2007, 17:53) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>More practically - is this really an issue? Do the SNCF have rescue diesels on standby along their own routes to rescue failed TGVs?? My understanding was that the "contingency plan" was the "so-called "ghost stations" - loops along the route where a train in trouble can be got out of the way and the passengers detrained , presumably into buses. There are 3 between Lille and Paris and another between Lille and Calais

While I'm not sure if we have "ghost" stations this side I understand that HS1 has got slow speed speed crossovers (50mph) which allow trains to leapfrog each other. Having said that an awful lot of HS1 does not lend its self to easy road access for de-training.

Regards
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
QUOTE (dbclass50 @ 27 Nov 2007, 11:48) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Maybe if they fitted 1 : 1 scale NEM pockets to everything it would solve a lot of problems (as long as Bachmann did not fit them ).

Then you would only have the disagreements between tension lock, knuckle, Kadee and profi to deal with!


Regards
 
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