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Bog Snorkeller
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987 Posts
Are you asking;-

1) Would someone like to do a write up on coach lighting, OR
2) Would we like you to do one.

If the latter, please feel welcome to have a go.

Mike
 

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Administrator
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QUOTE Martin71 did one on here using the Flicker Free from DCC Concepts I believe.

He did indeed - it's in the Reviews section - link - but don't let that put you off as there is more than one way to get lights into a coach.

David
 

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487 Posts
Will this system apply to DC 00 gauge model coaches?
How does the power required picked up? Only coaches adapted for lighting, use a sprung metal leaf located between the bogy wheel axles. Fleischman coaches in some instances use this method.
I am made to believe that this system require bogy wheels are insulated on on wheel to enable the correct polarity voltage to be picked up. A fault is that the LEDs vary in brilliance according to voltage applied to the rails feeding the locomotive/coach - as stated a suitable capacitor is essential to give a flicker free lighting within the coach while in motion.
 

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Premium Member
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774 Posts
Hi

To answer some of your questions

Will this system apply to DC 00 gauge model coaches?

Yes is works on DC and AC also DCC

How does the power required picked up?

As we speak I have tested the new 00 pickups which are easy to install. You can see the n gauge ones under new products. Im sure this will be added to the kit in future. In the past I have made my own pick ups.

Only coaches adapted for lighting, use a sprung metal leaf located between the bogy wheel axles. Fleischman coaches in some instances use this method.

I am made to believe that this system require bogy wheels are insulated on on wheel to enable the correct polarity voltage to be picked up.

If they didnt you would have a dead short the whole time on your layout, this is standard practice with metal wheels.

A fault is that the LEDs vary in brilliance according to voltage applied to the rails feeding the locomotive/coach - as stated a suitable capacitor is essential to give a flicker free lighting within the coach while in motion.

Once charged the cap supplies a fixed voltage keeping the lights at a constant level. Each kit is supplied with 1 k resistors but you can increse or reduce that depending on how you like your lighting


My suggestion buy a kit and try it, their is nothing better on the market as far as I can see.

Martin
 

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Just another modeller
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9,983 Posts
***
Yes, it is equally OK for AC, DC or DCC use. It will give constant lighting with no flickering on all power types. It will make sure the lights stay on for AC or DC layouts, even when the train stops as there is a LOT of power storage - supercapacitors with more than 200,000 microfarads.

The flickerfree is totally regulated on input power use too so there is no significant power use or any current surge at all as might be expected with big capacitance - a full train of ten coaches with flickerfree will draw less current than one sound equipped OO scale locomotive.

Any form of power pickup is acceptable, live axle, wipers, whatever you prefer.

There is no "Fault" with the system. The unit takes a few seconds only to reach full charge, and once that is done there is NO variane in brightness at all - power on or power off... You can even lift the coach off the track and depending on how many LED you have installed, it can stay lit for up to one hour.

Richard

QUOTE (double00 @ 15 Mar 2009, 03:45) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Will this system apply to DC 00 gauge model coaches?
How does the power required picked up? Only coaches adapted for lighting, use a sprung metal leaf located between the bogy wheel axles. Fleischman coaches in some instances use this method.
I am made to believe that this system require bogy wheels are insulated on on wheel to enable the correct polarity voltage to be picked up. A fault is that the LEDs vary in brilliance according to voltage applied to the rails feeding the locomotive/coach - as stated a suitable capacitor is essential to give a flicker free lighting within the coach while in motion.
 

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Premium Member
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3,614 Posts
The Flicker free is an excellent system.

though i have found that the "few seconds" to charge is a bit optimistic. a minute or 2 brings a nice constant glow.

dont worry about it discharging. i have found that after its charged i can just forget about it for the evening. it will quite happily sit glowing on a dead track for 30 mins or more!

Since doing that review i have indeed run a scratch brush over the LED's and it does make a big difference.

Peter
 

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Paul Hamilton aka &quot;Lancashire Fusilier&quot;
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844 Posts
Having just procured three LMS coaches from Neil Wood and having been the recipient of a pack of Flicker free from Richard as a result of participating in his test track layout design competition, I am now in a position to fully utilise the 6 pack which looks to have everything I need to light the coaches. I am a little confused about the pickups as I would have suspected that even one set of wipers on a bogie onseveral coaches would provide quite a bit of drag. Do the new ones from DCC Concepts work on a plunger style? I am unable to view the images in the N scale version that Martin posted due to work restrictions. Should I use the new 00 gauge items instead then?
 

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Just another modeller
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*** The new pickups are phosphor bronze spring pickups which are added to the coach axle and do not add any wheel pressure.

They always contact the axle but are a smooth sliding fit for the axle, so add no perceptable drag. You will need wheelsets with metal wheels and one wheel live to the axle. If both your wheels are insulated then use a brass "shorting disc" ex Bill bedford, or conductive epoxy to make one wheel on each axle live (Markits wheels and many others are available one shorted/one insulated too).

dead easy for any modeller to install, unlike conventional wiper pickups.

The 4mm scale version for 2mm axles will be a couple of weeks or so, the N version for 1.5mm axles is available now. $29.95 for a pack of 48 (usually in fact, 50+ - they are weight counted and we try to ensure we are never short, so end up being slightly generous).

Richard
 

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Hi

I had no intention of stealing your thread shumifan50 and I would like to see how you plan to do some lighting. I am very interested. We all have things we dont like doing eg ballasting ( I actually dont mind it) but I hate making and putting pick ups on coaches loco's etc.

Now Richard has developed new pickups and 1 word brilliant! I have tried the 00 gauge ones and the n gauge ones and both work extremely well.

Friction was my biggest concern with 10+ coaches in a rake and now this is a complete non issue with the new OO gauge pickups.

Sorry I cannot give you pictures of the OO gauge ones as the loco I put them on is currently at a static demo. Follow this link and about 1/4 way through you will see me lift the loco and its still running. Thats the new OO gauge pick ups.


A very short video of flicker free. This is one of the coaches that no longer exists.....it is one of 5 I left in my car and they got a little hot and now look like bananas! Oh and flicker free still worked. I showed the boys at the club (focus modeling) what had happened and you know nobody laughed, and I remember walking out that evening annoyed at my stupidity but thinking their a good bunch of blokes.

Maunsell coach with flicker free.


N Gauge pickups The OO look like this only bigger from memory 2.2mm in diameter.



If you plan to do your picks this is a very handy tool also from DCC Concepts. It has solved about 70-80% of my derailing problems. All your doing is making sure your back to back is correct. I run this over every new loco and rolling stock as I get it. You would be surprised how many wheels are out straight out of the box. I highly recommend this and for the price an excellent tool.



That should help.

Kind Regards,

Martin
 

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Paul Hamilton aka &quot;Lancashire Fusilier&quot;
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844 Posts
So with ignorance excused, I am not familiar with the wheel sets of the RTR coaching stock from B and H respectively. How do I determine if I need to obtain 3rd party wheel sets (Bill Bedfords?) or whether the wheel sets in the bogies as supplied will do the job? If they won't I have been unable to determine which item from BB will do the job. If I then digress and use a BB bogie kit are there further issues to be aware of? Hopefully others will find this question(s) of interest.
 

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Just another modeller
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*** BBedford only does an etched disc that is slipped on the axle and pressed against the wheel - it is to short a dead axle to one metal wheel to make it live. Its usually used in finescale work but will be OK for OO wheelsets. Personally I use conductive epoxy which is quick and easy to do when I need to short a wheel to an axle.

most wheels sold now on H * B coaches have live axles. Of the two, I personally prefer the hornby wheelsets which are quite economical and universally (so far) very true running - I haven't seen anything later than the B Mk1 coaches but was less happy with these - slightly rough ends to the bearing tapers which wear axleboxes and the basic wheel is less true on average than the H wheels.

Sources I'd recommend are either H or Markits 14mm coach wheels to replace the wheels on the coaches you have....both appear to be turned from solid and are dead true

Richard

PS: (Psychic statement)

..... puts hands to forehead: Yessss Paul, the Hornby 14mm wheels are live to the axle one side..... they will work exactly as you wish them to :) :) :).
 

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Paul Hamilton aka &quot;Lancashire Fusilier&quot;
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844 Posts
So would I be correct in expecting that the majority of the Hornby axles would fall into the live axle variety and thus require no further tweaking other than to include the addition of he new DCC Concepts coach pickup then?
 

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Just another modeller
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9,983 Posts
*** See PS in previous post
 

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Paul Hamilton aka &quot;Lancashire Fusilier&quot;
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The PS must have just struck me becasue I decided to review the post to ensure I had everything I needed.... thank you again Yoda!
 

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Premium Member
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3,614 Posts
without wishing to hijack a thread, how do people go about insulating a bogie?
for example on a kit built coach with whitemetal bogies? if i want to add lights, i can only pick up on one side because if i turn one of the bogies around it will short.

even more of a problem with DCC whin i would rather like the entire body including buffers to be insulated.

Peter
 

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Just another modeller
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*** Hi peter
use double sided (copper both sides) 1.6mm fibreglass PCB material for the coach floor.... Then you could easily isolate the bogies by cutting copper around them but still have a solderable surface for the fixing and details on both sides.

1.6mm Fibreglass is very stable compared to the phenolic boards, and having it double sided further increases stability. Not too exxy either....

If you were doing a kit, you could have the floor precut and etched to take care of it... PCB can be CNC cut very precisely at the same time as any kingpin drilling is pre-done, so it'd be a ready to use item for the kit purchasers.... It's only need at most the same pre-use smoothing that etched brass parts need anyway.
 
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