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QUOTE (dbclass50 @ 18 Dec 2006, 21:17) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Interesting - is the plug/socket a 6-pin one with the pins in line ?

If so it may be like the N-Gauge one used by others - it is also used (annoyingly) by Fleischmann in some of their HO locomotives.

Special note for GARY - there we are - I've thrown a critical comment about Fleischmann !

No this was not a six pin inline socket, but what I remember a unique plug and socket, a bit like a smaller version of one you would find on automotive electrics, so there was no way could we could just plug in another make of decoder.

I just cannot believe that Hornby has been so arrogant, or are they just being stupid over all this. I'm sorry if I have offended anyone on the forum about this statement but I feel some things have to be said. I think they need to get their house in order pretty quick, and by having someone keep on making up excuses and now empty threats over litigation, I fear is not going to endear too many people on this forum to Hornby's system.

Sid.
 

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QUOTE just cannot believe that Hornby has been so arrogant, or are they just being stupid over all this. I'm sorry if I have offended anyone on the forum about this statement but I feel some things have to be said. I think they need to get their house in order pretty quick, and by having someone keep on making up excuses and now empty threats over litigation, I fear is not going to endear too many people on this forum to Hornby's system.

This new tactic of frequently referring to litigation is interesting. I wonder who put him up to it? Captn Bob aka the bouncing Czech used to get away with a lot using that form of intimidation.
 

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I think that the concept of litigation has been bounced around a few other forums lately.

I doubt that anyone would honestly go to court over what is said on these forums. It would create a bigger 'stink' than what was said in the first place.

With that said, it should be remembered that it is a public forum and all sorts of people do read it. What do you think the company CEOs do all day long?

MMaD, please refer to my post above regarding personal attacks.
 

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QUOTE Hornby digital is a steep learning curve why is that ? is more difficult than other digital systems it shouldn't be, it was designed to be simple wasn't it ?

There is plenty of evidence on Hornby's own forum that Hornby Digital is a steep learning curve for Hornby customers. Bachmann EZ-Command was a steep learning curve for me first time around and its only when I watched the Bachmann rep at a show that I picked up on the concept of functions! The concept of operating with digital control in general combined with the high level of sales being enjoyed by Hornby digital has combined to produce the highest level ever of digital first time users in the UK.

My own personal view is that the Hornby Select instruction manual needs to be clearer and Hornby were surprised when I expressed this sentiment to them at the Warley Show. When designing a manual where massive sales are expected to first time users it is imperitve that you create a document that is clear in the extreme to avoid confusion which can lead you to believe your new machine is not funtioning correctly. The Hornby document should have clearer sequential instructions with a much larger number of photographic pictures rather than a limited number of diagramatic pictures and possibly introducing the concepts in a different sequence.

There seems to be an industry wide issue here with too much reliance on the internet and not enough reliance on providing a good, clear, simple manual designed to educate rather than make assumptions that the user already understands the concepts.

Notwithstanding this there will inevitably be new Hornby digital users signing up to Model Rail Forum. Are we going to take this onboard going forward when helping these new digital users out?


My concern is that there will be members who will persist in making comparisons with alternative equipment when these circumstances arrise rather than helping to educate those with their systems already purchased.

Happy modelling
Gary
 

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QUOTE (Sidney Sidings @ 18 Dec 2006, 22:36) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>No this was not a six pin inline socket, but what I remember a unique plug and socket, a bit like a smaller version of one you would find on automotive electrics, so there was no way could we could just plug in another make of decoder.

I just cannot believe that Hornby has been so arrogant, or are they just being stupid over all this. I'm sorry if I have offended anyone on the forum about this statement but I feel some things have to be said. I think they need to get their house in order pretty quick, and by having someone keep on making up excuses and now empty threats over litigation, I fear is not going to endear too many people on this forum to Hornby's system.

Sid.

Aren't the Bachmann dcc equiped loco's also hard wired to the cct board? Saves cost on manufacture to produce the chip as part of the board, just remove the whole lot and add another chip as normal. The models in the sets aren't the latest detailed offering's anyway and the market they are aimed at; I wouldn't think many would even think about replacing the chips.

I think Hornby have got it about right with the cost of the sets against the functionality. How many of us would be shouting down Hornby for releasing a £300 set with all knobs and whistles, instead of £150.

Darren
 

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QUOTE (neil_s_wood @ 18 Dec 2006, 21:49) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>You won't regret it John. I started off with a Roco digital system, the Lokmaus 2, and found it easy to use and reliable. The new Multimaus is a very good system and you'll find it easy to use and the instructions fairly easy to get going with. Good choice.

Thank you for your endorsement, now all I'll have to do is get someone to chip my somewhat strange fleet of locos for me!

Regards

John
 

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QUOTE (Gary @ 19 Dec 2006, 08:48) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>There seems to be an industry wide issue here with too much reliance on the internet and not enough reliance on providing a good, clear, simple manual designed to educate rather than make assumptions that the user already understands the concepts.

For once Gary I actually agree with you - I would even take it a step further & suggest that all manuals are in A4 format - we could then either copy them or laminate them or scan them or file them. Often I have copied manuals & sent by fax or snailmail to people who have lost theirs. Bigger text would help as well - it's bad enough having to stuggle with magnifiers & such without having to stuggle with small print.

Another point - when I started in DCC I found things very heavy going to understand - I did not get the chance to see in person someone else using DCC, but I persisted & one day several pennies dropped at once.

So, yes better manuals all round please !
 

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QUOTE My concern is that there will be members who will persist in making comparisons with alternative equipment when these circumstances arrise rather than helping to educate those with their systems already purchased.

I think it is only natural that comparisons will be made between different systems. The only way they can be separated out is if we have a different DCC section for beginners and for those who know a bit more. However I would say that regardless of their opinion of the budget DCC offerings, help is always offered and given by those on the forum with greater DCC knowledge.

QUOTE I think Hornby have got it about right with the cost of the sets against the functionality. How many of us would be shouting down Hornby for releasing a £300 set with all knobs and whistles, instead of £150.

Fair comment. Ultimately some corner of the market will feel that their requirements have not been addressed.

QUOTE There seems to be an industry wide issue here with too much reliance on the internet and not enough reliance on providing a good, clear, simple manual designed to educate rather than make assumptions that the user already understands the concepts.

Unbelievably enough I would agree with this too. Any DCC product or unit must have stand alone instructions with no reliance on websites for support. Some manuals are poorly written. However some manuals really go overboard. Have you seen the thickness of the manual that comes with the Lenz Gold decoder?
 
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