Model Railway Forum banner

Hairy's new layout

14570 Views 80 Replies 14 Participants Last post by  hairyhandedfool
A new start and a new plan.

So Ablingham has gone and I start to formulate thoughts, and those thoughts spawn more thoughts and from that, an idea. It needs to be something with an interesting sideline, or atleast one that adds operability and eases boredom. So I am going for a terminus, well sort of, a double ended terminus if that makes sense. I didn't particularly like the idea of no through trains, but space would be limited in a way, so any through trains would have to be short. I still want express trains though and what about freight, I have so many locos that freight really has to be there somewhere. So a branch line at one end joining a 'mainline' then a small yard to turn the freight round and a small station to go with it. Then a line along to the main station, but at the far end of the main station a single track to a small fiddle yard.

So to the drawing, its not exact yet, but the basis is there.

The Location.

I looked at my fleet of trains to gauge a new location. I have stock from all over the country now, 319s and networkers in the south east, a 170, 159 and 166 from south west London, but nothing there with common ground and running the same trains back and forward could be worse than what I had (for me atleast). I don't have much stock for wales and the Midlands either, so that leaves another Northern England layout or Scotland. well I do have some Strathclyde PTE units and a couple of other Scottish units. But I'm not sure about a fully scottish layout, as soon as you say scottish, their is an image that hits everyones minds, even if it is not the same image! So northern then? Well no, not exactly, I have a location mind, one that could be different if a railway had been there for a while, Peebles. Its far enough south to allow Northern units to run regular services and still close enough to Glasgow to give SPTE units a run (if they can be seen in Edinburgh and Newcastle, they can be seen in Peebles!).

The services.

The Northern units head East from Peebles through Glentress (the small(ish) station) and across to Galashiels, which is on the former Waverley route, then south to Hawick. At Hawick the line seperates, there is a line to Carlisle and a line to Newcastle. The Carlisle route pre-existed in real life, so no make believe there, but no railway to my knowledge crosses the National Park to get to Newcastle, so a bit of make believe there, but it does now run to the 'borders' line between Haydon Bridge and Hexham. With Newcastle-Carlisle services being hourly all day its difficult to justify a busier shedule than that, so bi-hourly to Newcastle and Carlisle with a few extra 'peak' trains.

The Scottish units will depart north west towards Fauldhouse and Shotts then join existing lines to Glasgow. there won't be much room to see these units if thats all they do, so, using existing prototypes I plan a service or two from Newcastle to Glasgow and back. In the real world they go to Carlisle under Northerns banner then north to Glasgow under Scotrails banner, but I have diverted some for my own ends. Otherwise another bi-hourly service with extra 'peak' trains.

Peebles won't be electrified, so West coast expresses wouldn't work, but GNER have HSTs, so it should be okay for a couple of services, and Cross Country is fairly easy to work in, so there a good diet. I was thinking a monirng GNER service from Leeds, departing to the capital afterwards and then the evening return workings, with Cross Country serving Peebles every other hour, or two.

Freight might seem limited and I suppose it is, but engineers wagons should provide some supply and the branch could support an industry, maybe a coal power station and a wagon repair depot or something like that (or even a coal mine, but I imagine that would have close long ago anyway!)

The test.

I made a test section to see how feasible the plan is, although the main station will have to wait for earth works (the removal of ballast!), Glentress gets a quick look.....

Any comments, good or bad (but not too bad!) welcome.
See less See more
1 - 20 of 81 Posts
Hi Hairy,

That sounds a very interesting project you are embarking on.

A couple of thoughts for your consideration though.

I know you say you don't like the idea of no through trains but I did a design for someone a while back now which has a continuous run for those express trains of yours and incorporates a rising branch line which could easily become goods orientated. The Main Staion is, however, a terminus though quite long trains can be accommodated. This layout design was only 9' x 8' and it seems you may have more space than that so could possibly make the main line terminus longer and more complex and have some good sweeping runs of track with plenty of scope for scenic treatments. Have a look and see what you think.

Incidentally, in the second picture, are the 4th & 5th carriages in from the near end derailed or does that baseboard have a bit of a dip in it ??
See less See more
I do like that plan, to an extent, of course I would have to 'modernise' it, but there is a potential issue with the chimney and loft hatch. I do like the idea of a passenger branch, maybe I could adjust something from it.

The board has a dip in it, although when the trains are moving it should be less noticeable, but I think I can get rid of it when I remove the boards to lay low level sidings, besides, how many railways are completely flat
See less See more
A proper plan has been drawn and there are some iffy biits but by 'n' large it seems to work. I've only got the trial version of Anyrail, so working with 50 pieces at a time was, well, tiresome, but with a bit of time, and a healthy portion of 'paint' work, the following was possible.

I opted for a ladder junction between Peebles and Glentress, the previous design thought looked too big an unrealistic to be an option when it is laid out.

I am somewhat concerned at the apparent lack of length at Peebles, but nothing that wouldn't have happened in real life I suppose. I think a 2+8 HST will just fit in the platform, but I had hoped to drag a 225 into Peebles, for when an HST isn't available for either of the GNER services (the pretence is that the rest of the diagram is 'under the wires').

Glentress is also a little short, I had aimed at 6 car platforms to account for services that used to run and the possibility of doubled up 3 car 158s, but I can live with it, would 6 coaches have been too much in this day and age on what is, in effect, a small line anyway? Most of the local services will be either a 2-car unit or 2x 2-car units, so there shouldn't be much of a problem there.

I'm also not sure about the fourth siding at Glentress (bottom) If I remove it I'll have more room for scenery, but with a planned covered stabling building on the two nearest the main line it gives just one line for freight to use, perhaps the loss of the building is needed here.

No bridges are shown, but I intend for a couple of road bridges for the main 'A' road, one between Peebles and Glentress and one the other side on Glentress which will have the access to the station on it. I'm considering a river bridge for the trains to pass over, as the railway would've run down a valley at this point, but where exactly this will go I don't know.
See less See more
That looks interesting. I particularly like the point work at the left end of Peebles station.

When I'm deciding whether or not a plan works on paper, I do some "what ifs" with the kind of trains I intend to run. So it's questions like "How does the coal train enter and leave the MPD?". "How do goods train get into the yard from each running line?". "Do goods trains need an avoiding line through the station?". "Do local passenger trains terminate and if so what happens to the loco?"

And so on....

The design of the trackwork is largely down to what I have and what I can use, given that this layout will be on a bit of a budget, but I wanted something a bit different, which could ease 'traffic flow' at the station.

The idea for the freight train was that the loco would run round its own train within the sidings, so it wouldn't have to use the mainline once it had entered the yard, but if I reduce the yard to three lines, with the stabling building in situe, the loco would have to use the mainline to run round.

The option would be that the freight could propel its train into the branch, is that ever allowed? Then again, I could use a pair of shunters (or a smallish loco like a 31) to propel the train down the branch, but if the shunter/31 waits in the headshunt for the train to arrive the loco would have to continue to Peebles. If I built a headshunt at the 'Fiddle' end of the yard, once the shunter had moved the train the loco could return to that headshunt ready to take the train back later.

The mainline won't be heavily used 'off-peak' so I suppose there is no great loss to use it for running round, but I can't think of many places were it would actually happen like that.

If propelling is the way forward, by shunter or the trains own loco, then it would ease planning of the storage sidings, in that I could have sidings below the surface and not have to have a run round down there, but thats not an impossible thing to do if needed.
See less See more
Like the plan - looks like a lot of operational interest & fun to operate (& dare I say it "play").
I've had some thoughts about run rounds in the low level storage area, so propelling might be avoidable, but actual planning is needed, more to follow.....

The last of 'Ablingham's' track was lifted last night and so test track was laid for the transition from low level sidings to Glentress Junction, but it didnt go according to plan, somewhere I have err-ed by six inches. The following plan is what was put out.

The head shunt will allow for better freight movements, but that was not the problem. the whole area was about six inches to the left of the planned path resulting in an R600 being added into the curves as they dive under the 'Scottish' end. It is good in that it removes a reverse curve, but I fear it will further shorten Glentress. Hopefully this is the only error made in the plan, I don't want to be re-arranging everything as I go.
See less See more
'Phase 1' of the fiddle yard is laid out as a test of what might be and I kinda like it, although there is an issue with a bow in the boards, but it isn't as severe as the pictures seem to show. This area will be directly below Peebles station.

The junction for the entrance to the fiddle yard sees the three entrance roads (Branch, Up and Down lines) condense to two tracks with the Down line spliting to feed the other lines. The Branch feeds two short sidings (top of the picture) and two long sidings with a run round facility, but also retains a link to the through road and consequently later sidings (Phase 2 & 3). Because of the arrangement of the junction the Down line also has access to the long freight sidings, but the Up line doesn't, not that it is a problem. The Up and Down line both feed into the other 7 sidings present. The three sidings nearest the operator feed an engine storage section, the track for which is the nearest to the camera leaving the right of the picture.

The next two shots are to try to illustrate the length of the yard, the stock is what was to hand last night and not a reflection of what will occupy the sidings. One of the freight sidings can't easily be seen, but it is behind the 156s on the right of the first shot. The GNER 225 is shortened slightly at 2+8 because of the need for a run round (for the diesel that will have to haul it!). Two sidings to the left is a 2+8 HST and two additional power cars!

The far end of 'Phase 1' shows how every run round flows, it also shows the end of the HST sidings. Now I must say right now that there is no intention to have trains this far down because of access to the point work, but having track this long will hopefully avoid any 'accidental' derailings


I give you the HSFT - High Speed Flask Train!

Just imagine if they let that out on the mainline!
See less See more
Progress report.

The storage sidings are now secured in place using double sided tape, we will see how they perform when the thing is up and running. The supports for the Peebles station area are in place and track and station placing has begun.

Peebles South Junction has been set out:

The station has been put out and tested using an HST for length, as you can just make out, the HST fits rather snugly! The 225 drags I had planned may need to be revised, but could I use a Co-Acting signal beyond the main signal?

The Terminus platforms have also been placed as a Scotrail 150 and a couple of 156s show. The Northern Rail Livery unit will have to reside in its box for the time being as Northern Rail and Virgin Cross Country HSTs don't mix. The Northern Spirit 156 will still be seen runnning to Newcastle though.

See less See more
With the 'Scottish' fiddle yard assembled, electricity was supplied to Peebles for the first time, with trains running into and out of the fiddle. The track can now be secured and cleaned (or should that be cleaned and secured!) and then maybe I can start getting some scenery sorted.

Some pics now, and first off a pic I didn't upload in time for the last post. The Intercity 47 shows how the short platform should be filled, although most of the time it will be a freight loco there but only on occasions.

Some stock pictures of the Scottish services. 156501 waits to leave for Glasgow.

And 156513 (although it could actually be 156510) arrives from the scottish city.

A 156 has also appeared at the other end of the layout in the form of 156420.
See less See more
Theorising the timetable

The timetable for services has been largely planned with most of the aspects I had planned to have incorporated, but with a few adjustments. Firstly, given the timescale of the layout and the relative position of real life depots. there will be just four passenger train operators, GNER, Virgin, Scotrail and Arriva Trains Northern. I had hoped to include First North Western on the Carlisle runs but the bnearest depot for them is in Manchester! So its not really plausible and ATN take that route too.

GNER will have just two in and out trips to Peebles, in from Leeds at 0810 and from Kings Cross at 2012, and out to Kings Cross at 0905 and to Leeds at 2105. Virgin will have arrivals every other hour at xx15 and departing at xx55 with one finishing its diagram at Peebles and resting overnight at Glentress, rready for the first train the next day. Scotrail will have the same frequency arriving at xx45 and departing at xx05 with just two exceptions each way, one starts and one finishes the day at Glentress stabling point and one goes on to Newcastle to return the next morning. Arriva have by far the most trains with hourly services alternating between Carlisle and Newcastle with three trains stabling over night and one unit during the day. Extra trains for peak time see some of those trains going 'fast' to Hawick, this helps them escape the clutches of the express trains, for a short while anyway!

'Phase 3' Progress

Unbelieveably 'phase 3' work had to start before 'phase 2' because of building room being at a premium. It has however provided a good lesson in planning, NEVER ASSUME ANYTHING! I thought that the loft would be some what symmetrical with both sides being the same height, but clearly builders don't think the same way. So,combined with my [lack of] wood-working skills here is the last 'phase 3' board in place....

'Phase 2' Progress

After the building of 'phase 3's last board 'phase 2' kicked into full swing.....

The tracks were laid out and some minor testing done.....

I had considered this space for some 'infrequent freight'......

....But I think I will save it for my Voyagers (I realise they will be a year early conmpared to when they actually entered service but whats a year betweens friends?)
See less See more

'Phase 3' sidings

'Phase 3' sidings are laid out, yet to be secured, and I had a few straights left over! I didn't get as many sidings as I would have liked, but I can still hold atleast twelve 2-car units there, some in 4-car formations and the freight from before, along with a rake of Yeoman/ARC hoppers. The first pic is the junction into the sidings the next two are views along the boards

Peebles South Junction

Peebles South Junction continues to be laid as a feat of engineering genius (thats what I call it anyway!) saw the sloping board from Peebles level to Glentress level laid (its all downhill from here! Well not quite, Glentress is flat!).

An illustration of the departure and arrival plan has now been made for the local services which should enable me to use single feather signals that are available RTR, rather than cobble together something from kits, Theatre Indicators would be nice here though, just a bit too high tech I think.

The local train leaves peebles from the centre platforms, taking the diverging route.....

It then passes onto the 'Up Loop' line for its stop at Glentress......

The returning service approaches on the Bi-directional 'Up Main' line and takes the diverging route onto the 'Down Main' line......

It then passes onto one of the two terminus lines, in this case the platform it left from.....

Some more stock photos, and something a little different......

And a Fastline 56....
See less See more
Good progres Hairy, Nice to see it coming along!
Looking good,lots of trackwork there.
See less See more
Excellent layuot with lots of operating potential i look forward to seeing more progress
See less See more
Thank you for the kind words, progress will probably halt over the weekend.

Inbetween proceedings though, thoughts on signal wiring are ongoing, more next week.....
'Phase 3'

'Phase 3' sidings have be cleaned and laid. For those who are interested the track was marked out (in pencil) removed and double sided tape laid in its place. The tape isn't very flexible so it was laid in straight lines....

The white backing was then removed in turn to allow the track to be carefully replaced.....

Signal Wiring

I'm attempting to take a low budget approach to signalling (if the real railway can do it....), so I don't think automatic detection is within my budget. I don't want to compromise on flowing signals though, so here is my first diagram for the wiring of the 'Down' signals. Bear in mind it is unlikely that more than one train will be moving at anyone time and all signals will have to be 'Controlled' as opposed to Automatic or Semi-Automatic, because of the junctions they protect.

The writing should say "These Switches Should Be Set The Same Way", but the resizing has made it hard to read. Now I realise it looks rather over-complicated (although it should be simple) and its not without its flaws, perhaps rotary switches may be the way forward rather than DPDT and DPST switches, but its a start. The main problem will be if the signals have a common return rather than seperate return wires, but if they can be altered it shouldn't be too much of an issue.

Perhaps its too much hassle to do it though, what do you all think?
See less See more
Might help if I describe the goings on in the diagram!

The signal on the left is the first signal out of the storage yard, the route indicator is to the lower of the middle two signals, which are at the end of Glentress. The bottom one is on the platform line ('Up Main') the other is on the 'Down Main'. the three signals on the right are at the end of Peebles, the lower one is for the terminus platform and the idea is that it can only show a proceed aspect if the other two are red.
1 - 20 of 81 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.