[Swingcats]

Hope someone can help me as I have no idea which signals to use or where to put them. Here is a plan, sorry it's hand drawn, of the station and sidings.

Where would you put the signals and which type where? Era GWR 1940's.

Also as the up and down directions are indicated which end would the signal box go?

Many thanks in advance

 

[PaulRhB]

I'll draw you up a simple plan using the Ratio signals, but first you have your direction of travel arrows the wrong way round, simple but a lot of us will notice and get all picky!

Trains travel on the left exactly the same as on a road, (hence the BR double arrow which is simply an up and down direction arrow overlapping each other).
You'll need 3 or 4 starting signals, (one might be replaced with a shunt dummy) and a couple of home signals. The Homes and starters all look identical, ie red plate with a vertical white band. You probably won't have room to fit in any distant signals as most layouts are too small.
The signalbox is most likely to go at the end where the entrance to the yard is as the rodding runs would be shorter and easier to pull, but that depended on all sorts or reasons such as if you had a level crossing the box would usually be next to it so the signalman overlooked the crossing and could have the operating wheel in the box.

 

[Swingcats]

Thats great, many thanks, i will run the trains the other way round, no worries! I was going to have a level crossing at the right hand end, but may put a bridge in instead. At the other end i have a gap between the tracks where the box can go.

many thanks

 

[PaulRhB]

If you want a level crossing there then do it but stick the signalbox next to it that's all. I've drawn up a diagram and I'll post it later when I get on the fast connection to upload the pic.

 

[PaulRhB]

Here you go, there are other possibilities but this shoud suffice as a start. I used to individual signals for the Up bay starter and the Up main as you can use the pre-built signals for this while you would have to assemble the bracket option from a kit.

I've nominally put London on the left but as long as the Line going towards London is called the Up then you are fine.

 

[Swingcats]

Many , many thanks for that, In the dim future when its all done I will send you a photo of the station.

 

[Al]

You also need to fit a crossover after the Down Home Signal and before the turnout to the bay platform.
Or you need to convert the Up line to by-directional running by mimicing the Down Home onto the Up line.
And finally, don't forget to interlock the goods yard entry turnout with the traps.

 

[PaulRhB]

A good suggestion as long as your layout is two loops as it will also allow access to the goods yard from both lines. I'd refrained from track alterations which is unusual for me!

 

[Robert Stokes]

Being a Midland modeller, I don't like that facing entry to the goods yard.

 

[John Webb]

QUOTE (Robert Stokes @ 8 Mar 2008, 10:55) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Being a Midland modeller, I don't like that facing entry to the goods yard.
I don't think the 'Board of Trade' who used to authorise railways to operate through the Railway Inspectorate would have liked it either. Almost certainly there would have been a head-shunt parallel to the main line and a trailing cross-over from the main line to admit goods trains. Has the advantage that the yard can be shunted without obstructing the main line and serves as a refuge siding to allow goods trains to be shunted aside to allow a passenger train to overtake as well.

Regards,
John Webb

PS We do have a 'Signalling' sub-forum within this 'Tracks, Layout and Scenery' forum which has quite a bit already on prototypical and model signalling.

 

[PaulRhB]

QUOTE (Robert Stokes @ 8 Mar 2008, 10:55) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Being a Midland modeller, I don't like that facing entry to the goods yard.
Not ideal, apart from junctions they always try to go for trailing points as they are safer but with his original diagram for direction of flow he had got that right, just I pointed out we run on the left!
It's a learning point for anyone but if you give people a list of how it's done on the real railway you risk making it very daunting for new modellers, ( also you will invariably find an exception where they 'did do it that way') This forum is very good in that it can cater for those that just like the models and want to run them and those that want to model a railway in miniature.
I have a fair idea of signalling as it's my job but I can't claim to have an exhaustive knowledge due to the variety of types on different regions and mine is all from experience on the Southern.
Maybe a checklist of basic layout planning features such as those raised in this thread would help some people who are aiming to make their layout closer to reality?
I read the articles on signalling your model railway in modelrail recently and I could have pointed out several flaws but if anyone is that interested they would probably do deeper research anyway. I was quite surprised to see that evidently Tokenless block is obsolete as we have it all the way down the West of England line!

In model railroader there's a cloumn that looks at a lot of the issues in real v models and pointed out how the train never waits for the manual points, in yards, as it would do in reality as we always move ahead and set them up in advance.

 

[Al]

QUOTE (John Webb @ 8 Mar 2008, 11:13) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I don't think the 'Board of Trade' who used to authorise railways to operate through the Railway Inspectorate would have liked it either. Almost certainly there would have been a head-shunt parallel to the main line and a trailing cross-over from the main line to admit goods trains. Has the advantage that the yard can be shunted without obstructing the main line and serves as a refuge siding to allow goods trains to be shunted aside to allow a passenger train to overtake as well.

Regards,
John Webb

PS We do have a 'Signalling' sub-forum within this 'Tracks, Layout and Scenery' forum which has quite a bit already on prototypical and model signalling.

Railways Inspectorate would have no objection as long as the turnout and trap points are interlocked as this provides protect of both the main line and the goods yard.
The absence of head shunt is a seperate issue. This could be over come by moving the signal box back sightly, changing the trap to a turnout and running the head shunt parrellel to the Down. Alternativly, and depending on the usage of the line, the down may be used with the introduction of an outer home and shunt signal on the inner home.

On the whole, Swingcat, that layout is pretty good. Just consider how you would run it. What trains do you want to go where...?

 

[Swingcats]

Thanks for all comments, All getting a bit technical for me, the layout was built 10 years ago and this is a rescue mission. I am not opposed to changing it, within reason. At the time it was a case of a very tight budget. So if any kind sole out there would draw me a layout alternative I would be most grateful. Quite a bit of modelling has already been done so if I can alter rather than demolish that would be good. The platforms can be moved if needed. The wiring was hidden below a platform extention to the edge of the board, this could also be moved.

Here is a photo of the existing layout, warts and all. The tracks diverge as they come out of the tight corner at one end as I was using flexi track and straightened out the joints on the curve. The result however separated the tracks more than is really wanted. The nearest long point is code 80 the rest are all Pecos code 55 as is the track.

Distance across yellow line is six and a half inches.

 

[Swingcats]

So am I right in thinking that this is better?

 

[Swingcats]

Al

Many thanks, your idea is better as it involves changes in an area which is easily changed and lets face it will look a lot better for the changes. Cheers Bud

Thanks Al

 

[Swingcats]

So three years on, nothing to show, I have pulled up all the track and completely dismantled this layout, starting from scratch again . I managed to save some scenary which I hope to use again. However the signal info will get used!