[oazman]

Hi All

I have bought recently an s88 module: I would like to run shuttle trains with my ECOS. I am not quite sure what I should section. Should I section out all of the length of track necessary for the loco to come to a stop or should I just section the point where the loco should start to reduce its speed?

Perhaps I've better explain. Refer to the diagram below:
_______________________________________
a ------------b---------------------c --------------d

In the ECOS manual they say that you have to position points b and c (where the loco starts to decelerate) spaced in such a way that the loco has time to come to a stop at a and d respectively. What I cannot figure out is the length of the isolated track section to which I must connect the S88 module: is it just point b or is it all of the track between a and b?

(the s88 manual is in german, so I can get nothing out of it!)

I have to know this before I go an modify my layout!

Thanks
Carlo

 

[john g]

hi Carlo,

you don't need sections a,b,c,d. all you need is say about the length of say 2 r603's hornby lengths of track or less. © first section = decellerate. (d) actual stop. it's up to yourself how far you want the loco to travel before stopping. whether or not your stopping at a station
or at a signal, it's all in the de-accelerating timing from slowing down to stopping.

ps hope this helps

john

 

[Vulcanbomber]

QUOTE (john g @ 3 Oct 2007, 17:49) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>hi Carlo,

you don't need sections a,b,c,d. all you need is say about the length of say 2 r603's hornby lengths of track or less. © first section = decellerate. (d) actual stop. it's up to yourself how far you want the loco to travel before stopping. whether or not your stopping at a station
or at a signal, it's all in the de-accelerating timing from slowing down to stopping.
ps hope this helps

john

look atNeil's Blog plenty of info there

 

[neil_s_wood]

What s-88s are you using? The LDT ones are best for DCC use with the ECOS. You can find the english manual on their website. The one that you want is the RM-GB-8-B. The Veissmann will give you problems.

I am currently only requiring three connections to each shuttle line, the two triggers at each end and a middle section. The length of the isolated track to bring the loco to a halt must be at least the length of the loco or unit that is drawing current. The middle section can as long as you like. I did a lot on this in my blog as Vulcan Bomber said, it may be worth having a look.

 

[oazman]

QUOTE (neil_s_wood @ 4 Oct 2007, 00:57) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>What s-88s are you using? The LDT ones are best for DCC use with the ECOS. You can find the english manual on their website. The one that you want is the RM-GB-8-B. The Veissmann will give you problems.

I am currently only requiring three connections to each shuttle line, the two triggers at each end and a middle section. The length of the isolated track to bring the loco to a halt must be at least the length of the loco or unit that is drawing current. The middle section can as long as you like. I did a lot on this in my blog as Vulcan Bomber said, it may be worth having a look.

Thanks: mine is a RM-GB-8 (with 8 connections to the track). I found the english manual on the LDT site.
I had a quick look at your blog and I am going to read it carefully later in the week.

So the S88 contact is really there to give the control unit the signal to start to slow down the loco, correct?
So for one shuttle train I need to connect the s88 to 2 short track sections (one for each station).

What about the stopping distance? I guess that you have to modify the train's speed (or acceleration/deceleration rates) so that you get the train to stop where you want. Is this correct?

One last question: the LDT manual says to connect the ECOS' red wire to the RM-GB-8. But on my ECOS I have a blue and a black wire! Do I just guess or is there a way of determining which wire to connect (is it the +ve or the -ve bias that you have to connect?)?

Thanks again!
Carlo

 

[neil_s_wood]

QUOTE (oazman @ 4 Oct 2007, 18:25) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Thanks: mine is a RM-GB-8 (with 8 connections to the track). I found the english manual on the LDT site.
I had a quick look at your blog and I am going to read it carefully later in the week.

So the S88 contact is really there to give the control unit the signal to start to slow down the loco, correct?

yes

So for one shuttle train I need to connect the s88 to 2 short track sections (one for each station).

Yes but also the section in between and the track sections must be at least the length of the loco drawing current

What about the stopping distance? I guess that you have to modify the train's speed (or acceleration/deceleration rates) so that you get the train to stop where you want. Is this correct?

Yes, I would recommend that you start at a relatively slow speed and test out stopping distances.

One last question: the LDT manual says to connect the ECOS' red wire to the RM-GB-8. But on my ECOS I have a blue and a black wire! Do I just guess or is there a way of determining which wire to connect (is it the +ve or the -ve bias that you have to connect?)?
Thanks again!
Carlo

Where it says red wire and I think from memory it is brown wire it just means the two power pires to the track. You have to get the polarity right so you may have to check you have the wires the right way around.

cheers

Neil

 

[oazman]

QUOTE (neil_s_wood @ 5 Oct 2007, 00:39) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Where it says red wire and I think from memory it is brown wire it just means the two power pires to the track. You have to get the polarity right so you may have to check you have the wires the right way around.

cheers

Neil
Thankyou all.

I found a diagram on the ECOS manual that tells you which wire is which (they also say that for 2 rail systems it doesn't matter which one you use, but I used the one that the LDT manual recommended anyway). Yesterday evening I did the connections and it works!

p.s. shuttle trains are GREAT!

Neil, regarding what you said a few messages ago:
>
>I am currently only requiring three connections to each shuttle line, the two triggers at each end and a middle section.

what is the middle section s88 connection for? can you get the train to stop at an intermediate station?

Carlo

 

[neil_s_wood]

QUOTE (oazman @ 5 Oct 2007, 20:32) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Thankyou all.

I found a diagram on the ECOS manual that tells you which wire is which (they also say that for 2 rail systems it doesn't matter which one you use, but I used the one that the LDT manual recommended anyway). Yesterday evening I did the connections and it works!

p.s. shuttle trains are GREAT!

Neil, regarding what you said a few messages ago:
>
>I am currently only requiring three connections to each shuttle line, the two triggers at each end and a middle section.

what is the middle section s88 connection for? can you get the train to stop at an intermediate station?

Carlo
No Carlo,
you can't get it tostop at an intermediate station. It is only for continuity. If you have an unmonitered section next to a monitored section it can give a faulty messgae to the system. It is better to have the middle section wired too in sequence.

Neil

 

[oazman]

QUOTE (neil_s_wood @ 5 Oct 2007, 23:46) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>No Carlo,
you can't get it tostop at an intermediate station. It is only for continuity. If you have an unmonitered section next to a monitored section it can give a faulty messgae to the system. It is better to have the middle section wired too in sequence.

Neil

Thanks.

Today I did some experimentation!
The thing that may be useful to share is that 2 shuttle trains cannot share the same s88 contacts. i.e. if you want shuttle 1 to go from a-b and shuttle 2 to go from some other station c to b then as soon as any of the 2 trains arrives at b both trains will stop and reverse as if they had arrived at station b. This can be fun in the sense that it would look as if one train changed it's mind along the way(!!), but it can lead to a crash I guess, if both trains happen to get to b at the same time. So what you must do is wire 4 contacts a,b1,b2,c and station b must have two platforms (b1 and b2): so the first train goes from a to b1, the second goes from c to b2.

Also if you happen to run another train on any of the busy s88 contacts (a,b1,b2 or c) the ecos will think that one of the trains has reached its destination and will make it stop and reverse! I had not realized that until today!

Also I found that often a good bet is to place the s88 contact in a piece of rail just in the middle of the platform (legthwise). This is so that you can tailor the speed and acceleration/deceleration of a greater number of trains: those trains which are running in reverse and that have coaches which draw current (because of interior lighting) will be detected by the s88 as soon as the last coach in the convoy runs over it. Those that do not have current drawing coaches will be detected as soon as the loco hits the s88. So the former will need to stop faster (lower speed/deceleration) while the latter will need to stop more slowly in order to get the coaches more or less nearer to the platform for the "little people" to get out of the train.

Anyway, even if you don't get them to stop exactly where you like, seing 2 trains move about unattended around the layout makes for a very realistic effect. Well worth it!!

Carlo

 

[neil_s_wood]

QUOTE (oazman @ 7 Oct 2007, 06:30) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Thanks.

Today I did some experimentation!
The thing that may be useful to share is that 2 shuttle trains cannot share the same s88 contacts. i.e. if you want shuttle 1 to go from a-b and shuttle 2 to go from some other station c to b then as soon as any of the 2 trains arrives at b both trains will stop and reverse as if they had arrived at station b. This can be fun in the sense that it would look as if one train changed it's mind along the way(!!), but it can lead to a crash I guess, if both trains happen to get to b at the same time. So what you must do is wire 4 contacts a,b1,b2,c and station b must have two platforms (b1 and b2): so the first train goes from a to b1, the second goes from c to b2.

Also if you happen to run another train on any of the busy s88 contacts (a,b1,b2 or c) the ecos will think that one of the trains has reached its destination and will make it stop and reverse! I had not realized that until today!

That is because the s-88 is picking up occupancy from the second locomotive as well as the first.

Also I found that often a good bet is to place the s88 contact in a piece of rail just in the middle of the platform (legthwise). This is so that you can tailor the speed and acceleration/deceleration of a greater number of trains: those trains which are running in reverse and that have coaches which draw current (because of interior lighting) will be detected by the s88 as soon as the last coach in the convoy runs over it. Those that do not have current drawing coaches will be detected as soon as the loco hits the s88. So the former will need to stop faster (lower speed/deceleration) while the latter will need to stop more slowly in order to get the coaches more or less nearer to the platform for the "little people" to get out of the train.

Anyway, even if you don't get them to stop exactly where you like, seing 2 trains move about unattended around the layout makes for a very realistic effect. Well worth it!!

Carlo

What I did here was to split one length of rail into four by sawing it into sections and reconnecting with isolating connectors. I then attached a dropper to each piece. This allows me to vary where the end and start of the trigger section is so that it can accomdate a variety of loco's or DMU's.