[Piemanlarger]

Did anyone else get any info on the hornby sound locos at Warley.

They had the 56 and duchess in operation, sadly no class 60.
SimonK said they are hornby's own sound and not done by howes as was the rumour? He said the 60 they recorded was very tired and has lots of character to it! Its due into shops this week?????

The 56 sounded nice but i only heard it at idle. seems thay have mounted the speaker under the exhaust ports.

They had the duches running and i thaught it was badly let down by the tender mounted speaker. Without seeing it, I would be surprised if it did have an enclosure as it sounded extremley "tinny." I thaught i sounded c r a p to be honest.
The recording seemed ok, but it definatley sounded a job for a Base reflex which for me, every steam (but not diesel) chip needs.

 

[80class]

I spent a while talknig about the duchess with the Hornby guys. I agree that as soon as I heard it, It was so obvious that the sound was coming from the tender, more so than on any other loco I've heard. I suspect that the speaker was loose inside the tender as there was some evidence of rattling. When i get my hands on one I'll know for sure. Hornby did tell me that they set up the recording session and recorded it themselves, however they wouldn't comment on who programmed the loksound 3.5 chip.

As a first impression, im still very hopeful that Hornby have got this one right. We will all find out soon enough as they are already in England and due in the shops in the next ten days.

Rob

 

[zmil]

QUOTE (Piemanlarger @ 24 Nov 2008, 18:18) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>They had the duches running and i thaught it was badly let down by the tender mounted speaker. Without seeing it, I would be surprised if it did have an enclosure as it sounded extremley "tinny." I thaught i sounded c r a p to be honest.
The recording seemed ok, but it definatley sounded a job for a Base reflex which for me, every steam (but not diesel) chip needs.

Hi Piemanlarger

Why would you not put a Base reflex enclosure on a diesel? Diesels produce some very low notes under load

Regards Zmil

 

[Piemanlarger]

Not all recording sound as good with base reflex as they do standard loksound speakers.

eg, i have class 37 with 2 x 23ml round loksound speakers in tanks, and another with base reflex in tank and 20x40 base enhanced under fan.
When i too it to my model railway club, all that heard it 10+ agreed the 2 x 23 round speaker insallation gave the best results. I know a number of other sound chip class 37 owners who have come to the same conclusion.

Now on the 67 i prefere, just, the base reflex when it comes to the sound of the horns. Engine wise there is not much betwen them

Class 66 i like both versions.

 

[zmil]

Hi All

It all makes more sense to me now , the 23mm is that the standard speaker you get with the Loksound?

Regards Zmil

 

[Richard Johnson]

*** Interesting comment:

We find the result better in Steam with multiple well sealed enclosures, and found that whilst the Bass Reflex sounded good on the bench it was often totally lost when actually installed in a tender, as is common with "enclosures within enclosures", as the result is a sort of approximate bandpass enclosure which removes much of the added benefit.

A well designed ported box can peak Bass energy at a tuned level BUT it needs perfect applicaton to achieve that...

In fact the Potential for Bass extension and roll off is actually always 4x better in a perfectly sealed enclosure - thats just the law of physics. (ie: bearing in mind that -3db = a halving of audio energy, a sealed enclosure is 6db per octave whereas a ported box rolls off at 12db per octave, giving much better potential for sealed IF the enclosure is properly designed and truly sealed and IF the sound decoder can reproduce it). Of course we don't often see that achieved as modellers don't bother sealing the enclosures properly, so all beneffit is lost!

Bass reflex speakers need to be directly coupled to the outside air to do their job properly - so we them use in diesels with good transparency with the grills but only rarely in steam.

Regards

Richard

 

[zmil]

Hi All

So get that silastic sealer out !

The 20x 40mm Loksound enclosure I used on my little BR212 Diesel is pointed directly down over the unpowered bogie
so it is fairly free to move some air .

Regards Zmil

 

[neil_s_wood]

I've got one of the Hornby Duchess's on order. Now I'm starting to get worried.

 

[80class]

I wouldn't worry yet Neil. Even if it does turn out to be a poor job, you can always have the chip reprogrammed. Still less expensive than buying the loco and the chip seperatly! It is a loksound 3.5 chip and the sounds were recorded from a duchess, so worse case it should be passable.

Rob

 

[Piemanlarger]

QUOTE (neil_s_wood @ 24 Nov 2008, 20:11) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I've got one of the Hornby Duchess's on order. Now I'm starting to get worried.

I`m sure a short amount of time experimenting with speakers will have you felling much better!

From experience, i have found every different sound chip, steam or diesel, needs experimenting with various speakers and placings to find the best results.

While the Swd GWR and Ivatt both sounded much better to myself and those that heard it (did try the gwr with 2 x 23 ml in a hall) with the base reflex.
Now i think about it i did not like the whistle on the Howes spamcan and left it on loksound speaker, a 20 x 40 i think it was.

Each to their own, but as an experienced sound loco operater both at home and at shows, I can honestly say the hornby duchess at warley was tinny.

 

[barrymx5]

Grateful for more on Howes Spamcan Piemanlager.
I have posted the following on another thread so you can see where I am coming from:
I am still struggling with the basics of sound, having just bought Digitrix Super Chief and got a DC equipped Hornby M7 ad 3F running - silently of course. I am aware of WAV files but there seem to be innumerable other types of sound file. I have just bought a Digitrax PR3 to try and down load files on to a sound decoder, which I have yet to purchase but am tempted by Loksound 3.5 after following this site. There are so few British steam sound available - or at least that I have been able to find. I am unclear whether I can only upload a Loksound sound file on to a Loksound decoder, Digitrax sound file onto a Digitrax FX decoder etc. or whether I can use any file on any sound decoder. SWD is located quite close to me (when I am home- I am currently on holiday in USA) so I am naturally inclined to them but their website only shows 4 Steam loco sounds and warns against generic steam sounds!
Sorry if this is very basic stuff ermm.gif

 

[zmil]

Hi All
That's the problem with the different brands of Sound decoder

They all require the use of their own Programmer to edit or upload sounds
Which is fine if you buy only one brand of Sound Decoder

Regards Zmil

 

[barrymx5]

Thanks Zmil. So where is the NMRA when you need them?

 

[zmil]

Most Sound Decoders (but not all) are NMRA compliant
They use the correct CV's ,can be programmed by a DCC System controller, but the sound files are loaded via a computer interface which comes with software

The JMRI software makes general programming of CV's a lot easier and have specific programming sets for different decoders - ESU loksound has a JMRI programming set with different pages or tabs to program different things Sound levels
function remapping, lights, motor control, speed curves etc

But if you want to play with the sound files you need to buy the ESU Interface (its about $20-$30 more than the price of the sound decoder) Then you can edit the sound files or upload new ones .Plus the usual CV programming.

Regards Zmil

 

[neil_s_wood]

QUOTE I`m sure a short amount of time experimenting with speakers will have you felling much better!

From experience, i have found every different sound chip, steam or diesel, needs experimenting with various speakers and placings to find the best results.

I'll try different speakers then. It seems that will be the solution.

You're not the only person to comment on the sound being rattly or tinny.

 

[Piemanlarger]

QUOTE (barrymx5 @ 24 Nov 2008, 23:49) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Grateful for more on Howes Spamcan Piemanlager.

What did you want to know?

I personally dont have the time really to do my own sound projects, I am happy to pay £100 +/- a time for rtr sound chips.

The spamcan was ok, a little basic in play factor and kind of machine gunner like at speed (no of cylinder) so i prefered operating it at slow speeds but better than nothing.

Here, amoung all th diesel clips and the ivatt steam chip is a clip of the howes spamcan in actio!

 

[barrymx5]

Thanks. I was not aware of Howes but have now checked out their website and found the WC sound decoder. I think I am going to have to put one in my City of Wells!

 

[Thunder]

Duchess, (City of Sheffield) R2782XS, im hopeing to be the proud owner of one of these locos, and it will be my first ever loco with sound, but after readinfg some of the reports here, im now wondering if i should wait a while longer, sureley Hornby would not reaese a steam loco with sound, if it sounds as "tinny" as mentioned above, would they?

 

[Piemanlarger]

this is hornby we are talking about!!!

It may have been that the warley example was some sort of pre production vrsion? As soon as the sound locos, I believe all three arrive together this week, arrive, I will pop to local model shop and video + u-tube the three. Thats presuming i dont actually bring the class 60 home!

 

[Thunder]

I will look forward to Piemanlargers comments on the duchesses sound, if the first loco i purchase with sound, turns out to be a bit naff, it will probrably put me off purchasing others, whe ever produceses them.