Liliput Baureihe 42 1800 DR, Ep.II Tarnfarbe - Review
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Nice review Doug, I have been thinking about this one myself.
The dodgy smoke box light is common on some German outline locos. My take on it is that you are only supposed to see the flicker.
With the Seuthe smoke units you often have to take the body off to ensure that the contacts on the smoke generator meet the contacts on the loco. If they are out they wont work.
Do you have any pictures of what the camo should look like?
The dodgy smoke box light is common on some German outline locos. My take on it is that you are only supposed to see the flicker.
With the Seuthe smoke units you often have to take the body off to ensure that the contacts on the smoke generator meet the contacts on the loco. If they are out they wont work.
Do you have any pictures of what the camo should look like?
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QUOTE (Doug @ 17 May 2008, 09:02) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>The smoke circuit is not switchable... should it be?
Doug,
Thanks for a very nice review.
I think it can be. The purple wire of the decoder does that job.
Baykal
Doug,
Thanks for a very nice review.
I think it can be. The purple wire of the decoder does that job.
Baykal
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1,601 Posts
A great review of a nice locomotive. That is such a great historic photo of the Floridsdorf locomotive works.
Interesting that Bachman say that the DRG built 844 class 42 were as Thomas Nosske Epoch 2 site ( http://www.hs-merseburg.de/~nosske/EpocheII/e2xd.html ) says there were 853.
John
Interesting that Bachman say that the DRG built 844 class 42 were as Thomas Nosske Epoch 2 site ( http://www.hs-merseburg.de/~nosske/EpocheII/e2xd.html ) says there were 853.
John
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Nice review Doug & thanks for taking the time to produce it.
Don't know about that camouflage though - it just does not look right to me, & that alone would stop me from wanting one.
I would have thought that the smoke function was switchable.
Don't know about that camouflage though - it just does not look right to me, & that alone would stop me from wanting one.
I would have thought that the smoke function was switchable.
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QUOTE (Doug @ 17 May 2008, 16:02) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>The smoke circuit is not switchable... should it be?
***Hi Doug. Looking at the review the "wireless" smoke unit is simply across the rails...no chance of control at all You will need to buy another smoke unit with two wires to be able to control it - one SU wire to the blue wire, one SU wire to the green or purple.
However...
I really wouldn't trust it to a Lenz Gold. They already run hot and have quite wimpy function power capability.
This is a good chance for you to try either a LokSound steam install or a TCS T4 f fn decoder as they have 250Ma function ability (even though they claim less, the transistor they use on their Fns is 200Ma + capable quite safely.
Richard
DCCconcepts
***Hi Doug. Looking at the review the "wireless" smoke unit is simply across the rails...no chance of control at all You will need to buy another smoke unit with two wires to be able to control it - one SU wire to the blue wire, one SU wire to the green or purple.
However...
I really wouldn't trust it to a Lenz Gold. They already run hot and have quite wimpy function power capability.
This is a good chance for you to try either a LokSound steam install or a TCS T4 f fn decoder as they have 250Ma function ability (even though they claim less, the transistor they use on their Fns is 200Ma + capable quite safely.
Richard
DCCconcepts
The camo itself is correct; a summer/fall 1944 eastern front camo.
Only thing is, the class 42 never wore it.
The 42 was not used near the frontline, due to its weight restrictions and, considering the fact that the front was closing in on Germany, less engines were necessary by 1944, and the class 52s could handle that traffic alone. Add to this that these "new" engines weren´t to be "wasted" on the Soviet front.
Some 42s did wear the 1944/1945 winter camo though, because that was necessary to escape strafing fighter planes in winter.
Only thing is, the class 42 never wore it.
The 42 was not used near the frontline, due to its weight restrictions and, considering the fact that the front was closing in on Germany, less engines were necessary by 1944, and the class 52s could handle that traffic alone. Add to this that these "new" engines weren´t to be "wasted" on the Soviet front.
Some 42s did wear the 1944/1945 winter camo though, because that was necessary to escape strafing fighter planes in winter.
Very thorough review and nice to be able to do it. The scenery and layout look quite picturesque and must be part of an amazing layout.
I really like the photo of the Floridsdorf Locomotive Werks.
You get a real sense of the place.
As for the comments by ME-26-06, It is interesting the part played by railways in any war . It has often been said that such large scale gatherings (or amassings) were only possible using the railway system. This is especially true o the part played by railway in the First World War. However, as with any technology, it is neutral and it how we use it that determines whether it is positive o negative.
Makes one think
However.........................onwards
I really like the photo of the Floridsdorf Locomotive Werks.
You get a real sense of the place.
As for the comments by ME-26-06, It is interesting the part played by railways in any war . It has often been said that such large scale gatherings (or amassings) were only possible using the railway system. This is especially true o the part played by railway in the First World War. However, as with any technology, it is neutral and it how we use it that determines whether it is positive o negative.
Makes one think
However.........................onwards
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With smoke generators which don't have their own specific function they are usually linked to the lights as with Roco locos. I'm not sure about Liliput though as my only Liliput loco with pre installed smoke generator never worked as their was a problem with the circuit.
Hi
Very good review Doug, looks great on your layout. Love the cam pattern it looks mint!
Ahhh I was green with envy when I saw one of these Richard had running that he had just added sound to. I couldn't believe the detail on it and how good are those working lit black out markers on the front and rear. I plan to get one of these some day.
Is it a good runner and is it tricky to work on? I cant remember now but the one Richard had also had a firebox glow or was that something he added to it? Does this one have it? One interesting point Richard passed on the German logo is missing the swastika in the centre as it is illegal to use it, even on models.
Love it, love it, love it, got to have one, great review and as I have said before I buy lots based on the reviews here.
Thanks.
m
Very good review Doug, looks great on your layout. Love the cam pattern it looks mint!
Ahhh I was green with envy when I saw one of these Richard had running that he had just added sound to. I couldn't believe the detail on it and how good are those working lit black out markers on the front and rear. I plan to get one of these some day.
Is it a good runner and is it tricky to work on? I cant remember now but the one Richard had also had a firebox glow or was that something he added to it? Does this one have it? One interesting point Richard passed on the German logo is missing the swastika in the centre as it is illegal to use it, even on models.
Love it, love it, love it, got to have one, great review and as I have said before I buy lots based on the reviews here.
Thanks.
m
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QUOTE (Martin71 @ 5 Jun 2008, 15:15) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>the German logo is missing the swastika in the centre as it is illegal to use it, even on models.
AFAIK it is now permitted on models provided that they are historical and accurate.
AFAIK it is now permitted on models provided that they are historical and accurate.
QUOTE (Martin71 @ 5 Jun 2008, 15:15) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>One interesting point Richard passed on the German logo is missing the swastika in the centre as it is illegal to use it, even on models.
The swastika found little usage on classes 42 and 52, except on locos used for propaganda and representation. In case of the class 52, the class is a simplified version of the pre-war class 50 built for a lifetime of ca. ten years. The class 42 were designed to the same specifications except the increased power. They have been designed and ordered by the war department for military duty in late WW II. At that point, Germany already had lost the war. So, besides construction, the lettering also was of simpliest standard - with painted letters "Deutsche Reichsbahn" and the class and running number dirctly painted on smoke box door, cabsides and tender rear. In contrast to pre- and post war Reichsbahn and Bundesbahn locos not on brass or nickel silver plates. With regard of that, all the Liliput classes 52 and 42 wartime (epoch II) lettering is correct.
Even tanks and military vehicle were not applied swastikas - national emblem of the german army in WW II was the straight-lined iron cross (Balkenkreuz). The Reichsbahn swastika emblem introduced 1938 generally is to be found on more prestigious locos such as the classes 01.10 and 03.10 streamlined Pacifics, the Henschel-Wegmann-train locos (class 61) and other passenger locos, but only rarely on freight locos.
The swastika found little usage on classes 42 and 52, except on locos used for propaganda and representation. In case of the class 52, the class is a simplified version of the pre-war class 50 built for a lifetime of ca. ten years. The class 42 were designed to the same specifications except the increased power. They have been designed and ordered by the war department for military duty in late WW II. At that point, Germany already had lost the war. So, besides construction, the lettering also was of simpliest standard - with painted letters "Deutsche Reichsbahn" and the class and running number dirctly painted on smoke box door, cabsides and tender rear. In contrast to pre- and post war Reichsbahn and Bundesbahn locos not on brass or nickel silver plates. With regard of that, all the Liliput classes 52 and 42 wartime (epoch II) lettering is correct.
Even tanks and military vehicle were not applied swastikas - national emblem of the german army in WW II was the straight-lined iron cross (Balkenkreuz). The Reichsbahn swastika emblem introduced 1938 generally is to be found on more prestigious locos such as the classes 01.10 and 03.10 streamlined Pacifics, the Henschel-Wegmann-train locos (class 61) and other passenger locos, but only rarely on freight locos.
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I have a Liliput (proper one not a Bachmann one) 05.001 with the Olympic Rings on the tender & the swastika on the left hand smokebox. In the box is an additional swastika that can be put on the other side. These were supplied separately so that the owner could fit them if required - I bought mine secondhand & the previous owner had just fitted them one side.
Being an original Lilput in the wood effect box & made in Austria makes me wonder if it is actually illagal or just not "the done thing" on historical models ?
Being an original Lilput in the wood effect box & made in Austria makes me wonder if it is actually illagal or just not "the done thing" on historical models ?
QUOTE (Brian Considine @ 19 Jul 2008, 12:32) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Being an original Lilput in the wood effect box & made in Austria makes me wonder if it is actually illagal or just not "the done thing" on historical models ?
It has to be differed between Austria and Germany. In Germany, the usage of the swastika as a symbol of propagandistic media of a national socialist organisation generally is interdicted. As an exception, it may, inter alia, be used restrictedly in connection with art, science, reporting on events of the day or history, civic education or similar (German Basic Law, article 86 para. 4). A swastika on a railway model does not belong to any of these groups, except maybe in relation to an exhibition e.g. about the Reichsbahn at war.
In Austria, demonstration of a swastika is accusable only in connexion with an (undefinate) pro-fascism campaigning. It is likely that a merely presentation of a swastika on a historic model is not accusable under Austrian law.
It has to be differed between Austria and Germany. In Germany, the usage of the swastika as a symbol of propagandistic media of a national socialist organisation generally is interdicted. As an exception, it may, inter alia, be used restrictedly in connection with art, science, reporting on events of the day or history, civic education or similar (German Basic Law, article 86 para. 4). A swastika on a railway model does not belong to any of these groups, except maybe in relation to an exhibition e.g. about the Reichsbahn at war.
In Austria, demonstration of a swastika is accusable only in connexion with an (undefinate) pro-fascism campaigning. It is likely that a merely presentation of a swastika on a historic model is not accusable under Austrian law.
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And yet it this month's Railway magazine (I think) there was a Drajeeling B Class with a swastika emblazoned on the smokebox.... One has to remember that the symbol pre-dated the Nazis by thousands of years and is a sacred sign in India.
Ho hum!
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60134
Ho hum!
60134
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I think its important to understand where the swastika was located as well.
I thought that we were talking about it being in the globe within the claws of the eagle printed on the cab side. For a long time Manufacturers put an x in the globe.
John
I thought that we were talking about it being in the globe within the claws of the eagle printed on the cab side. For a long time Manufacturers put an x in the globe.
John
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