Methylated Spirits

QUOTE (Doddsy @ 11 Mar 2009, 18:16) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Just a quick query -

I have seen suggested, the use of Meths as opposed to water and a drop of washing up liquid to dilute PVA for setting ballast. So - this morning, duty bound, off I went with the Missus (she wanted a new Mobile Phone - Got a Blackberry - Nah! I'm not Jealous that I have another 6 months in contract - at all!! - I digress!!). Went to Wilkos and bought a bottle of meths. Went home, bunged some into some PVA and produced... Well! ... What could only be described as PURPLE SNOT!! Threw it away and went back to water and WU liquid.

What happened?

Hi Doddsy,

The mix of PVA/meths/water works fine ... how old is the PVA i'm tempted to ask as it can go off and not mix well .... i usually mix up a batch in a jar well for a ballast/glueing session mixed thoroughly no reason why it wont work and flow a lot better, if ballasting get the ballast in place and soak with meths sprayed over then the glue mix and soak again with meths .... i tried this method after Richard posted it and found it to be the best way of easing a laborious job on our layouts.

*** I just finished ballasting my test track layout with exactly the mixture as I recommended in earlier posts. Methylated spirits, PVA and water.

did you use some water as well as the Meths?? The need to do that was clear in my explanation. pour meths and water into glue and stir well... it mixes and blends well and there is no "snot" problem with any reasonable quality PVA glue I have ever tried.

The ratios aren't critical but you can use less glue - about half as much... as I did this time - I actually used the extra glue as I am aware modellers seem hell bent on a heavy glue proportion so I wanted to try it to see if there was any issue - there wasn't, as the meths made the flow excellent even with much more glue than I usually include in the mix.

The ratio I used this time was very approximately 25% PVA and the balance about half each meths and water.

Used a mister (ex window sleaner spray bottle) to spray on neat meths to wet the ballast
spread the glue using a syrings with no needle in it
re-sprayed the ballast with meths after applying glue.

Re Methylated spirits: The colour disappears when using it for ballast... but you can use any alcohol.

Poliss, lighter fluid is not alcohol and is very volatile - you should not use it. There is no issue spraying meths - to make the point for you that there is no issue with spraying meths, its less dangerous or flammable than some household kitchen / bathroom aerosols.

I also smoke in the same room as I was ballasting in - no explosion yet .

Richard

Richard,

Oooops! - Silly me! I seem to have forgotten the water stage.

As I still have some PVA/Water mix left, I will put some meths in that and see what happens.

Perhaps someone here is chemically astute enough to explain, in layman's terms, what went on though! I, for one, would be interested to know.

Cheers

Ian

QUOTE (Doddsy @ 14 Mar 2009, 06:38) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Richard,

Oooops! - Silly me! I seem to have forgotten the water stage.

As I still have some PVA/Water mix left, I will put some meths in that and see what happens.

Perhaps someone here is chemically astute enough to explain, in layman's terms, what went on though! I, for one, would be interested to know.

Cheers

Ian

This isnt a chemical explination but the PVA acted like fat when it hits water it solidified

***Hello Poliss, yes I am appropriately qualified to stock and store them in bulk and dispense them via my business to appropriate consumers and am totally aware of their characteristics and limited dangers.

Your post reads impressively but most workers in the storage areas at the BP refinery and distribution centre only a mile from my office have the same sort qualifications. It is not rocket science.

To be honest I see no relevance in your comment.... and given what you claim, it makes me wonder why you would even think of suggesting something like lighter fluid which is an extremely volatile liquid of far greater danger and not chemically compatible with PVA glue in the first place!

I have a very good working knowledge of most chemicals I use and where I am unsure I can very easily reference all the data I need via my suppliers info - or if at all concerned via the several university based chemists I have as clients.

I have used meths in the manner discussed and many other chemicals in many circumstances in absolute safety with no problem for a very long time. There is absolutely no overt danger in using mehtylated spirits in the way I do and recommend others to do it. It can and does work better than traditional ballastng methods and has clear advantages as well as being totally safe.

When I discuss anything I talk real world issues and real world use... I always do as I say and say as I do, and never simply spout unfounded theory.

I certainly stand behind the statement that some household chemicals in spray form are far more personally dangerous than plain IPA or methylated spirits!

Regards

Richard