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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Post 1, so hello everyone.

Is it me or is an air-con MK2 coach in the intercity swallow livery not available? I'm expecting that it's just me and I have failed miserably on my searching of the web, could someone point me in the right direction.

An example of what I'm looking to create is at the beginning of this vid:
.

Cheers, Joe
 

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Hi SmokeyJoe and welcome to the forum.
I think Hornby made some swallow Mk2s a decade or so back, but I may be wrong.
Wanted to say how much I enjoyed that video - lots going on and plenty of variety at Birmingham NS - that NSE stock travelled far and wide, eh?
mal
 

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Hi Smokey JoeWelcome to MRF, as of yet no one has made aircon MK2 coaches yet..Hornby did have some old non-aircon stock many years ago, I think it was the old Airfix stock recycled (someone correct me if I am wrong) but the best ones at the minute are from Bachmann, but again are not air conThere was some rummor a while ago that Bachmann might re-tool there Mk2's and at the same time introduce the ones you are looking for, for me I hope they do, I want to reproduce the 'Green Train' for my heritage rail tours. Lets just keep the fingers crossed and see what comes out in this years new range a ed of the month

Brian
CME Milldale
 

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QUOTE (bro sewell @ 8 Jan 2009, 10:02) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>as of yet no one has made aircon MK2 coaches yet..Hornby did have some old non-aircon stock many years ago
Apologies, SmokeyJoe,

Brian - thanks for correction

mal
 

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Was the colour scheme shown in your video better known as raspberry ripple ? Just thinking that might help in searches. Also i saw no swallow on the video and am wondering if my memory is correct and that was a variation on the livery shown. If anyone knows better I stand corrected as I have not lived in the UK for any of this time. I have seen models of coaches in this livery but do not remember which mark 2 it was.
regards, Andrew
 

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I thought, for coaching stock atleast, 'Swallow' livery and 'Executive' livery were basically the same, the difference being the lettering. 'Executive' had 'Intercity' on the side whereas 'Swallow' had 'INTERCITY' on the side.
 

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I can't see the video for some reason, but I'm pretty sure the swallow only ever appeared on locos, power cars and DVTs. As HHF suggests the coaches were lettered INTERCITY
 

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QUOTE (bro sewell @ 8 Jan 2009, 10:02) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>[...] as of yet no one has made aircon MK2 coaches yet..Hornby did have some old non-aircon stock many years ago, I think it was the old Airfix stock recycled (someone correct me if I am wrong) [...]

I bought some old Airfix Mk2 stock at a swapmeet some years ago, and it's certainly meant to be 2D/E/F with sealed windows. Doesn't that mean it's air-con, working on the logic that unopenable windows indicate the presence of air-con equipment?

QUOTE (hairyhandedfool @ 8 Jan 2009, 12:59) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I thought, for coaching stock atleast, 'Swallow' livery and 'Executive' livery were basically the same, the difference being the lettering. 'Executive' had 'Intercity' on the side whereas 'Swallow' had 'INTERCITY' on the side.

That's correct.

This
and this
were part of the same identity, introduced in 1989.

All InterCity liveries were based ultimately on the APT-E, and it seems Swallow was the final development of that. The 'Livery' section of the Wikipedia article on BR InterCity is quite useful. Apparently 'mainline' was the designation for the grey/white/red livery with no written branding.

QUOTE (Edwin @ 8 Jan 2009, 13:25) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I can't see the video for some reason, but I'm pretty sure the swallow only ever appeared on locos, power cars and DVTs. As HHF suggests the coaches were lettered INTERCITY

Pretty sure you're right about the swallow on rolling stock, Edwin -- I don't remember it.

Cheers,

Tom
 

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Mk2d/e/f with the sealed windows are definitely aircon and there have definitely been models of this stock in OO. I had a some of the Airfix ones too, back in the blue/grey era. I've a feeling Hornby bought the moulds but as I now model in N I'm not sure of this nor do I know what liveries might have been produced in the past 20+ years.
 

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Quite - mine are blue-grey, not raspberry ripple. I've never seen factory-finish exec, mainline or swallow on a 00 Mk2, either. Sorry SmokeyJoe...
 

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When this ex Airfix/Mainline coach type (Mk2d FO, TSO, BSO) was produced by Dapol they produced the 'Raspberry Ripple' as the Executive livery (not SWALLOW).

Since passing in-to Hornby's hands this coach has been produced in Blue/Grey, Virgin, Anglia, FGW *** Packet and Riviera Trains 'Blue Pullman' Liveries but not 'Raspberry Ripple' either as Executive or Swallow.

Not sure if many Mk 2d's actually carried the swallow livery, more likely to be Mk2e's and 2f's.

Waiting for a retool from Hornby or new offering from Bachmann please!

Also need some more R4216A/B Blue Grey TSO's except Hornby have kindly deleted these even though the accompanying R4215 FO is still freely available.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Wow, hello everyone, thanks for the good response.

First an apology, I knew as I was writing the original post that I wouldn't get the nomenclature quite right when describing the livery, hence the video.

Just to clarify things for those who couldn't see the video here is a picture of the set I would like to create and the type of MK2 coach and livery I was talking about.



From the general feedback it would seem they aren't available. A shame, that was my era, being dragged up and down the WCML behind a 47 in the Mk2s in the early 90.
 

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Those coaches are not the same as the Hornby/Dapol/Airfix coaches, however they do look like the old Lima model. The Hornby model has two toilet windows (the white ones) on one side only, the Lima model has one on each side. The Lima model will be quite hard to get hold of though, I think.

I don't know how common a 47 was on the WCML though, didn't 86s take over trains at Birmingham?
 

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QUOTE Those coaches are not the same as the Hornby/Dapol/Airfix coaches, however they do look like the old Lima model. The Hornby model has two toilet windows (the white ones) on one side only, the Lima model has one on each side. The Lima model will be quite hard to get hold of though, I think.

The Hornby (ex Airfix) model has two toilet windows (the white ones) on one side only = Mk2d TSO

The Lima model has one on each side = Mk2f TSO (but the Lima Model is not of the latest standards and underscale length)
 

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QUOTE (hairyhandedfool @ 9 Jan 2009, 10:13) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I don't know how common a 47 was on the WCML though, didn't 86s take over trains at Birmingham?
The 47s were used on the the southern half of the cross-country services from Birmingham NS such as Edinburgh-Poole, or Edinburgh-Brighton via Carstairs (and many others). Virgin XC used 47s until they got hold of some IC125s saving the loco change.
mal
 

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I thought HSTs were East Coast routes and Mk2s were West Coast routes until the Voyagers came along. I know its not unheard of for 47s to go north of Birmingham on XC trains (I myself saw 47703 on an XC service at Manchester, headed for Paddington about 1998-2000), just thought 86s were the norm.
 

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QUOTE (hairyhandedfool @ 10 Jan 2009, 09:17) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I thought HSTs were East Coast routes and Mk2s were West Coast routes until the Voyagers came along.

The West Coast got the first production Mk.3s (Mk.3a) back in 1975, just before the first production HSTs appeared. They differ in detail (most obviously buffers) and electrical equipment compared to those in HSTs, but are largely similar.
 

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Yeah, sorry, didn't make it clear, I meant, I thought Intercity (Virgin) Cross Country services were HST on the East Coast route and Mk2s were West Coast routes, not Intercity (Virgin) West Coast services.
 

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QUOTE (hairyhandedfool @ 17 Jan 2009, 09:59) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Yeah, sorry, didn't make it clear, I meant, I thought Intercity (Virgin) Cross Country services were HST on the East Coast route and Mk2s were West Coast routes, not Intercity (Virgin) West Coast services.
Yes, you're quite right, although I think the Mk2 sets had gone before the Voyagers arrived, and HSTs were sometimes used on WCML cross country services from Dundee or Edinburgh
mal
 
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