I'm afraid general and unsubstanted negative comment of this type is somewhat unhelpful, especially on this subject of all subjects
QUOTE my issue concerning running quality centres around an issue of,''who'' is doing the quality control?
Personally, I don't think it should be the customer!
But increasingly I read, here or in other forums, etc, where the customer IS in fact the QC....
We've reached the point where the relevant postings should be linked or quoted , so we can see which model from which manufacturer is at issue
You're specifically claiming that the Vi-Trains 37 runs better than the Bachmann 37 and that the Bachmann 37 is frequently defective . Neither claim , frankly, can be supported by much evidence
The only reports of any mechanical issues on the Mk3 Bachmann 37/4 are a couple of isolated reports of drive shafts popping out of their sockets, noted above . The cure is to take the body off and put the drive shaft back in its socket - a 5 minute job , and not a warranty issue. No such issue is documented with the Mk1 and Mk2 Bachmann 37/4. The Vi-Trains 37 has had a number of well-documented QC/build quality issues of its own , referred to above . Mostly (as these things tend to be) on the first batches
The whole subject of Bachmann's 3 successive models of the 37/4 has sparked endless bitter warfare on the internet, which has spilled over into specialist print sources. It's all been over body shape issues , which you said you didn't care about - nobody's criticised performance , and if there had been anything to criticise , interested parties would have shouted it from the housetops. In fact Bachmann's very vocal critics have been very quiet about the mechanisms , probably because they are vastly better than those of the old Lima model
QUOTE which this reader finds totally unwarranted, when issues of 'quality of operation' are frequently overlooked, from competitors?
which, given the 'standing ' of those competitors within the model railway market...should not happen. in my view
I don't find such issues of quality of operation with OO RTR diesel locos and DMUs tooled in the last 10 years by Bachmann, Hornby, or Heljan (Even the Pendolino, with an avowedly cheap and cheerful mechanism, runs adequetely). Models that originated 15-25 years ago are a different story , but the Bachmann 37s are brand new
For the record, Railway Modeller tested the rival 37s on a gradient of 1 in 36 on a 3' radius curve . Vi-Trains model with traction tyres managed 12 coaches , Bachmann's model 10 (For comparison , dwb's Jubilee managed just 6 coaches on 1:50 on a 3' curve) . Clearly on level track either 37 will pull far more than most of us can accomodate on our layouts. I've seen both models run light at slow speed, and both ran smoothly and slowly. Possibly an advantage to the Bachmann model fitted with a Lenz Gold . Either will knock spots off the Lima and Hornby models of the previous generation when it comes to running
And I really don't get your references to "standing in the model railway world". |Your desciription of the Bachmann 37s reputation :
QUOTE yet, that is what I read regarding some of our most vaunted RTR models. would be bizarre if it wasn't so bitterly ironic
What exactly is Bachmann's reputation? In the US, they are regarded as not a premium brand, though the Spectrum range is seen as adequete. On this forum , many posters seem to have a relatively poor opinion of OO RTR and its manufacturers in general. And very specifically , Bachmann in particular have been targeted by an orchestrated campaign of attacks on their latest models by certain prominent internet critics [not on this forum]over a number of years . Those who have dissented from such attacks have found themselves attacked by the critics. And nowhere has the fighting been closer and bitterer for longer than over the successive Bachmann 37s. They are to D+E wars what the Ypres Salient was to World War 1 . I've heard stories of people being banned from specialist forums controlled by prominent critics simply because they said something vaguely positive about the Mk1 Bachmann 37 (One victim seems to have been a modeller on your own home patch). And all of this bloodletting has been over body shape issues, which you say you don't think important - not over the mechanism or the running qualities which are vastly better than previous Lima models. With Lima you did have to pick and choose to find a good runner.
QUOTE Bachmann have established a reputation.....'credibility', perhaps Bachmann have had bricks put through their windows at every opportunity , despite being responsible for nearly all the positive developments in 4mm D+E over the last 15 years . Pilgrims to the shrine are sadly lacking , so I don't think excessive respect is the issue
QUOTE NOBODY IS OUT TO 'TEACH ANYONE A LESSON''. There is a suspicion in 4mm D+E that certain prominent critics may perhasps be out to "teach Bachmann a lesson" and maybe Heljan too. Certain of them seem to have some old connections with the people behind Vi-Trains , and in the eyes of some who have crossed those critics in other contexts, Vi-Trains choosing this subject above all, and releasing their model just 2 months before the long expected Mk3 Bachmann 37/4 , seemed just too much of a co-incidence. Whatever the facts may be, sadly the Vi-Trains 37 is a highly political model. To have posted as you've done , on any other forum or context, would instantly have been read as a very highly political posting, with a clear agenda, and a very overt declaration of open factional allegance. MRF doesn't do D+E , and from some of your other posts your interests lie elsewhere, so I very much assume you're completely and blissfully ignorant of the wretched hornets nest you're busily poking here
QUOTE what THIS reader see's in the critique of Vitrain's efforts, is total dismissal.
which this reader finds totally unwarranted, when issues of 'quality of operation' are frequently overlooked, from competitors?
which, given the 'standing ' of those competitors within the model railway market...should not happen. in my view.
Hardly:
Okyedoke
QUOTE So close and yet so far then?
Although much better than the awful Hornby and old Lima models, the ViTrain 37 falls just a bit short in too many departments.
Ravenser
QUOTE You won't go too far wrong with the Vi-Trains 37 (it's not old style Lima)- but Bachmann have done it that much better
That's hardly total dismissal. You want to read someone really putting the boot into a OO diesel (there've been plenty of dotty diatribes to choose from) It's not like anyone's accused intending purchasers of having "blood on their hands".....
If the Vi-Trains 37 had been released 10 years ago , we'd have been awestruck and the magazines would have dripped superlatives . These days its so-so and Bachmann have done the job better. That's an index of how far 4mm D+E has advanced in 10 years
