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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello,

I'd thought I'll post something about a new project I'm starting on which is in its early stages.

I was inspired by a video on Youtube of a Rh 2143 cab ride from St. Polten to St. Aegyd showing nice shunting work with some logging wagons. Since I have some OeBB diesels sitting around which are not used on an Austrian overhead electrified layout which I'm also working on I thought why not build a module(s) so I can run a module/layout with passenger and freight diesel locos.

St. Aegyd am Neuwalde being literally one stop away from the terminus station, St. Aegyd am Markt, of the Traisentalbahn I thought this could make an interesting Fremo end module.

I managed recently to obtain aerial/satellite images of St. Aegyd and re-scaled the images after a lot of stitching together on an image editing program (Inkscape) and saved the resulting "plan" in N scale. After this I printed out the image on A4 paper with a poster printing program.

The plan is 3m long, but this will be 2 modules each 1.5m long by 450mm wide. Due to the exit/entry of the station I will have to make an additional two adapter modules for both ends to be Fremo compliant with a width of 400mm with a single track.

You can see in the following photos of the individual pieces of paper laid out on the floor with some vehicles and wagons to get a 3D feel of the module.


The whole length of the station.


Logging industry part of the module.


Entry of the station from the direction of St. Polten; here there is a hardware store.

I'd spent last weekend putting together all the individual pieces of A4 paper together with some double sided tape so that the plan can be rolled up and unrolled as and when required for the moment. The following photos show the plan partially with EW 190 1:9 templates to make sure the points are the right size before ordering pcb boards of the points which will be hand layed with Code 40 rails. I also put two diesel Rh5047, which I recently won on Ebay at half the cost of RRP (both brand new), on to the plan again to get some feel in 3D.

Following photos are a bit foggy for some reason so apologies for the quality.





I'll add more info as this project progresses.

Cheers
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Hi,

A small update on this project.

I started planning the construction of the two main modules' framing/benchwork.

The following images are 3D renderings of the modules' framing done in CAD with roadbed ballast and track; it is a rough mock up but helps in visualizing how the wood work has to be built.
A more detailed construction of the framing will be done.







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That looks like a great way to see how the baseboard cross members and pointwork line up so that you can ensure clearance for point motors.

David
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Hi,

Yes it's very useful. I will have to adjust one point whose entry point is actually sitting within one exit of another point in the paper printout; not a Doppelweiche (DW) but getting pretty close. This will I reckon cause one of the evenly spaced cross members to interfere with one motor so either an adjustment of the rogue cross member or shift/fudge the track longitudinally.

In the meantime I will be buying a plunge saw with a guide rail for ripping the hardboard 6mm and 3.2mm thick into 15/20mm strips for the spline sub-roadbed; unfortunately my current timber merchant supplier will only rip down to 50mm for safety reasons unlike my previous merchant who ripped a whole sheet down in 30mm strips for a fiver. Also I will be buying a 2m long extruded aluminium right angle to act as a fence for clamping the splines when glueing since the majority of the trackwork is straight. Gone away from using sheet baseboards/cookie cutter approach due to high wastage.

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Hi,

Another update today.

To get a more accurate layout of the track in CAD I placed a template image of the satellite/aerial photo image I'd made earlier. The points were adjusted and the track lengths adjusted to be as close as possible as the image. There are some very small inaccuracies in the image due to distortion of the original aerial/satellite images but by ensuring the parallel track is correctly spaced on the main 4 lengths, being 4700mm in real life, made the fitting and laying of the track easier in CAD comparing with the image.

I also made adjustments and added more details to the modules' framing; end plates (currently at 400mm wide instead of the target 450mm), adjustment in the number of transverse beams and adding legs currently set for the track top to be 1100mm above ground level.

The following images show a templated and untemplated views of the modules.









Next step is to import into the CAD app 3d files of the connector blocks for the wiring in strategic positions for the main bus, droppers, electronic components and point motors etc.

Cheers
 

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Wow!
It's fascinating to see how you're using technology to help with everything!
If I tried that, I'd spend all my time simply trying to learn how to use the technology and software! The best I can do is "Anyrail" and it's not been that long since I graduated from pencil and paper!
Good for you, will be interesting to see how you progress.
Cheers,
John.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Hi John,

Glad you find this interesting. I've been using this particular software for over 10 years and it is more like AutoCAD in behaviour with a strong bias to 3D even though track planning is its main function. The software is called 3rdPlanIt by Eldorado Software; for me I reckon it is probably the most powerful tool out there after overcoming the learning curve. With all CAD software they have pros and cons, some being simpler in getting the job done and those requiring a steep learning curve.

This particular software really shines in that you can model in 3D a room in your home and build your layout to fit. Also it allows you to operate rolling stock and "play" with a throttle window and follow it on your layout in 3D as well as recording it; useful in seeing if your layout is fun or not before committing.

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Hello again,

I received yesterday the pcbs for the EW190 1:9 points (3 RH and 2 LH) along with 10 straight track pcbs each 290mm long. These can be seen below in the photo along with the brass templates and a pack of 500mm code 40 rails.



In the next two images you can see a close up of one point and a straight track piece. On first site it looks untidy since there are minute pieces of swarf from the milling of the pcb; this can be easily cleaned up gently with a fibreglass bristle pen. Using any other tool for cleaning will most likely cause damage. I will use a file to clean up the edges once cut out of the pcb framing.





So this weekend I'll be cleaning up all the pieces ready for hand laying in the future.

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hi,

Another update for this project; a bit of a mix of things being done.

Firstly on the CAD planning side of things I've managed to import into 3PI, after having to jump through various hoops in file conversions, an MTB MP1 point motor (courtesy of MTB providing me a CAD file) which I intend to use for this project, and various connector block components from Wago.

The following two images show the parts imported into 3PI and edited with correct colouring; this was a painfully slow process to do.




Secondly I'd spent sometime cleaning the PCB track components I'd received before Christmas. The following image shows code 40 flat bottom rails placed unsoldered but weighted down on to a straight piece of track in gauge with a wagon on it. As one can see things are starting to look a bit more interesting.



Furthermore not being happy with the steam roller/pizza cutter type of wheels supplied as standard with all RTR stock from the major manufacturers I've sourced some finescale wheels. These wheels have a total tyre width of 1.3mm with the flange width being 0.3mm as well as being 0.3mm high. To illustrate the difference between these wheels and a typical RTR wheel see the following 2 photos; I just hung the finescale wheel on the end of an RTR axle from a Minitrix SBB Snps wagon. Since prototype wagon wheels in line with UIC standards are typically 920mm in diameter, these finescale wheels are pretty close being a scaled down version of 36" diameter wheels. Eventually I will have to order some 33" finescale wheels for the diesel Arnold Rh5047s which I intend to use on this project.




I fitted onto two axles of a single bogie/truck with 4 new wheels with a back to back gauge of 8.4mm. The following photos from 2 angles show the comparison between a unmodified bogie and a modified bogie. The wagon has been placed this time on Peco code 55 track for the moment (these photos embarrassingly also show how dusty the wagon has got; time for a dusting down is in order). I will post at a later date the differences when on code 40 track.







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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Hello again,

I have a small update on the project. With real life getting in the way recently, things have slowed down a bit. However in order to get the right look for the track I wish to lay I built a straight section on scrap piece of timber sub-roadbed in a rush to just to get an idea on colours for the rail, concrete sleepers and ballast.

I took one straight section of copper clad sleepers which had been cleaned up during Christmas last year. To simulate concrete sleepers I used Rust-Oleum natural effects "Limestone" spray paint on the straight section. After the paint had dried I cleaned off carefully the paint on each copper clad chair with a glass fibre pen. Each copper chair had a small smear of solder paste and both rails were placed. Funnily the solder paste makes life a lot easier since it has a tacky quality allowing the flat bottom of the rail to stay in place, so the rails won't flop down easily onto their sides. I carefully put the rails into gauge and proceeded to solder the rails down every 8 sleepers and then halving each time down with a combination of a track gauge and wooden block to hold the the rails down flat as I heated the rail. Once complete I cleaned as much as possible any excess solder that may have wicked up the sides of the rail.

I had a stab at painting the rails and chairs a rusty colour by hand with Rail match "Dark Rust" with out a masking tape to speed up the test build. In a nutshell the colour is too red even after placing a thin wash of Rail Match's "Sleeper Grime". However the sleepers which were also washed came out very good. Looking closely at the sleepers under a magnifying glass the effect was very impressive and the fine texture of the "Limestone" paint is in my opinion fine enough for N scale.

I glued a rubber roadbed onto the scrap block and glued the track section on to the roadbed. Subsequently I placed a grey brown ballast on to the roadbed. I wasn't too worried about ballast appearing on the sleeper tops since the prototype I want to model is pretty untidy. I glued the ballast down and then formed an earth foundation on either side of the track.

As mentioned earlier I didn't like the colour of the rail so I removed as much of it as I could.

The result is shown below:



And a few images with some rolling stock placed onto it:







Overall it's kind of the look I am after. I will have to repaint with another shade of colour onto the rails and I am not too sure about the ballast. The ballast is like sand and I had a bit of difficulty with the adhesive used even when using IPA to wet the ballast. I plan to do some modifications tonight.

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Hi mate,
That looks very fine to me (looking from the dizzy heights of H0 scale anyway!).
I have done a little work in P4 (1/76 scale) but that is fine enough for me, I couldn't do this in 1/160 scale!
Good work!
John.
 

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Hi John,

Thanks.

It's my first crack at fiNescale and I am exploring all the ways to do it as easily as possible. Last night I removed the track and ballast and resprayed the sleepers and the rails were sprayed with Krylon "Camouflage Brown". The colour is darker than I want; ideally the colour of Rust-Oleum Camouflage "Earth Brown" looks bang on from what I can see on the net, it has a nice tinge of redness to it. Unfortunately this particular line of paint is not available in the UK only Australia and the US.

I will be picking up some AK-Interactive pigments for the rust highlighting and shading; just want to push the boundaries as they say. I've come to the limits of using my mobile phone for the images I need a decent DSLR camera like a Nikon D3300 with a decent macro lens, the depth of field on the phone is poor the images are too much out of focus around the subject.

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Hi,

Time for another update. Apart from fiddling about with the test track, I've started to look at details for the module(s) which will have to be made; buildings, lighting, buffer stops etc. The station to this day still uses 2nd generation (1950-1975) OeBB lights, basically fluorescent tubes probably replaced with led tube equivalents. At present no manufacturer makes a realistic scaled whip lamp with a long fluorescent type housing so I decided to have a crack at making my own. I snooped around on the internet looking at various photos of these types of lamps and came to the conclusion that the majority of these type of "Glesifeldleuchte" are on the vertical part 10m high.

I bought a range of brass micro tubes ranging from 1.5mm down to 0.5mm OD (outer diameter) so that they can be slide into each other to mimic the typical masts I've seen. In the end I cut up 4 sections to length using 1.3mm, 1.1mm, 0.9mm and 0.7mm OD tubes to represent the 10m height vertical mast section. I soldered these with solder paste and cleaned carefully the excess solder with fine sandpaper to represent the fillet joins. The final part for the whip boom was a 0.5mm OD tube and this has a 0.3mm ID (inner diameter) cut to a predetermined length; this is the limit of tube size if one wants to feed 38AWG enamelled magnet wire and also closely represents the typical 76mm diameter arms. I fed for the meantime two 0.1mm wire solid nickel wires into this tube with a lot of foul language during the process; easiest method is making sure the wire is absolutely straight i.e. no kinks or knots and feed in with a grip close to the entry point of the tube so that the wire does not kink if any resistance is met as it slides in. After successfully feeding the wires I slide the boom straight into the main mast without any difficulty. Bent the boom gently to a 30 degree angle to the horizontal. I carefully soldered this section. Again some cleaning up with fine sanding paper.

The result so far is shown below in the following photos along with the assistance of a "rangierarbeiter";







So far quite happy with this test piece. The next step is to somehow make the housing for the lighting; a thin aluminium sheet is probably best for the upper half and somehow formed and cut. Most likely will be using 4 to 5 pico leds in series for the lighting. I have been curious about side glow optic fibre but these will need quite high power leds to get a realistic fluorescent tube effect; I have seen 0.25mm diameter side glow fibre optic filaments on Alibaba but not on the main market; how effective they would be at such a small size is unknown at the moment. Further thinking on this will be required along with further experiments.

Cheers
 

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Hi mate,
That is lovely work on those posts, they do look very fine indeed.
I hope you don't think I am trying to teach you to suck eggs here (!) and certainly not to detract from your work but do you need to feed two wires through the post?
I made a (1 mm O/D) stove chimney that I fed the power for my signalbox lighting through and used the chimney itself as one pole, so only needed one wire for the opposite pole. I just wondered if that kind of trick would save you some frustrations? I'm guessing I used copper or brass tube for my chimney so I could solder to it.


Sorry it's not a very good photo, best I have at the moment! You can only really see the 'works' part where all the wires come out but hopefully, you get the gist of what I mean.
If you need three poles of course, feel free to completely ignore me!
Cheers,
John.
 

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Hi John,

Thanks for the advice and I'm always open to criticism and suggestions
. I had considered using the actual mast as a return loop for the current and use one wire only, maybe an option.

I still have to think how to drill either manually or with a micro power tool the exposed tube sides for some mast steps made out of spring wire. This link shows how to cross drill a 0.5mm brass tube manually with a 0.1mm drill bit; in my case this could be done before the inner boom/arm tube with the wire is inserted.

On top of that I'm also looking at using an M3 vented cap machine screw (hollow inside to accommodate an extended tube and the wires) with an M3 nut and spacer. The head of the screw being flat will be the base.

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Hello again,

Another small update. I continued experimenting with the test track by changing the ballast, weathering the rail and adding some greenery.

Well the ballast, even though I like the colour, is too big it's more suited for TT scale so I'm reverting back to the original ballast manufacturer I used the first time but with a different ballast which appears to be half way between the original and the latest used in colour. Rail looks ok to me but still the there are places where the base colour shines through so may need a blast of dullcote. Also the sleepers will need more weathering now looking too new after the greenery was added.

As for the static grass I have mixed thoughts; the grass is from Polak and it looks great when layered and does not suffer from the glossy fibres evident in other brands, unfortunately I'm experiencing an issue in getting the grass to be more upright. I did a bit of research on the net and some are experiencing a similar problem to what I'm finding. One key thing I read is that the fibres are post processed to get rid of the shine which may affect the static charging of the fibres unlike the glossy fibres. Some say that static grass when applied with an applicator perform better when conditions are humid/moist than dry conditions; one suggestion was to place a damp coffee filter paper in a container with the static grass left over night which I will try but have my reservations that this will solve the problem. It could be one or more factors in that the fibres are so small that the thickness of the adhesive whether too little or too much causes it fall on its side, too many fibres are landing on top of each other causing it fall down due to weight or even needing a higher power applicator which is usually reserved for longer fibres ... when looking at the end product (see photos at the bottom) it does look pleasing with the blends achieved but for the moment lacks height in areas so I will need to add longer fibres. I have used a variety of fine foam from Woodland Scenics to create the bushes and weeds but will need more variety.

Apart from fiddling around with the test track I have worked a bit more on the CAD side of things for the track plan. Having looked more and more at photos of the station on the net there is a very subtle difference in elevation of all the parallel tracks to each other so I've adjusted the tracks' elevations which can be seen in the CAD image below. Also when laying the track in CAD with the satellite image template it was evident that two points have a larger radius than my initial assumption that all were 190m radius; so an order for one left and right EW300 1:9 PCBs is required. Furthermore I've added rough a rough mockup of the goods shed and a small storage shed. A lot of the buildings in model will have to be scratch built however the goods shed may not have to be built from scratch but more of a conversion of a laser cut kit I stumbled upon. The kit is from a Czech company called Igra and the goods shed is based from a Czech station called Dacice. What is interesting is that this form/design of goods shed was very common in the Austro Hungarian Empire, in fact a lot of their kits (HO/TT/N) would not look out of place on an Austrian layout.





These photos of the test track were taken at dusk yesterday taking advantage of the light from the setting sun; interesting effect on the majority of the photos is the reflected sunlight coming through the bushes causing the blue card board backdrop to appear to have clouds ....









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Hi again,

I made an order a while back from an Austrian dealer to get hold of the goods shed kit made by Igra which I mentioned in an earlier post, also the dealer had recently got hold of some interesting bits and pieces of 3D printed items made by kasteNbahner of which I ordered a 6 pack of OeBB platform edges each 105mm long (based on UB-5 type edging now pretty much standard everywhere in Austria).

I'll start with the Igra lasercut kit. The kit comes in a lift up lid box and within you get a polybag which holds the laser cut items, an instruction booklet, a strip of signs/markings (not decal) and some glue. With regard to the instructions its all in Czech so a careful study of the parts and the images in the instruction leaflet is required to build the kit.



I was pleasantly surprised with the quality of the laser cut items, very fine, using card stock of 1mm thickness and 0.6mm/1mm 3 ply BR grade plywood. There is some curling with the card stock but that can be remedied. It really was the plywood grade which caught my attention which was exceptionally smooth hence me grading it as BR (probably Finnish). This grade of plywood is sanded smooth and is the best type to use for laser cutting intricate pieces, other grades would otherwise be rougher.





As I said before there will have to be some modifications made to the kit to closely resemble the good sheds I want based on the protoype. Firstly on the building all the windows are taller than I want, one end of the structure has 3 windows instead of one, the other end at the loading platform/ramp has the door closed off and a has a pair of double doors to the left of it. I've been mulling over how to do this but the main parts to modify are shown below as well the window panes and glazing. Also the wood cladding along all sides are wider in the prototype. I could arrange to make my own custom laser cut parts of these after taking careful measurements of these pieces ensuring they can combine with the other kit parts as well making a pair of double doors.



The roof of the building is pretty accurate, in the prototype one end has had the slate roofing covered with roof tiles so a modification will have to be made here as well.

Finally the last modification is in extending the loading platform by about another 2 cms which can be seen in the photo below when comparing the base from the kit to the scaled satellite image.



There are other small interesting modifications and additions that can be made like waste pipes and guttering etc. To get a clearer idea of the modifications for the kit follow this link to see photos of the shed in question and the station and other structures I will need to build. The water tower/pump station and loco shed would be really fun to make, as well as the main station building which is now a cake /coffee shop since passenger services are only now down as far to Traisen the rest of the route to Sankt Aegyd am Markt is for freight traffic use.

On to the platform edge this is pretty useful I will need around another 9 lengths of these to cover what I want. These are fairly close to what I want, quality of the 3D print is good, there will be some light sanding required to remove the ridges which can be seen in the close up below which is a pretty common feature on all 3D prints.



Since I'm pretty much housebound today due to the Prudential cycling event and the rotten weather, I'll have a tinker with the good sheds kit and do a temporary build with the main parts.

Cheers
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Hi again,

Taking advantage of the glorious weather we have this bank holiday weekend I managed to mock up the goods shed kit shown in my previous post. Its a temporary build using Tacky Wax from Deluxe Materials so there are imperfections. I find this a useful exercise before a final build of any kit to see problem areas and getting to grips with putting a kit together. There are items I didn't bother with like doors, interior floor etc and the odd structural element since they weren't critical in getting the structure assembled.

The following photos show the structure without the roof attached. I'm very tempted to go the extra mileage and detail the interior properly with hanging lights and some tat. The supplied card floor in the kit will most likely be replaced with a proper laser cut timber floor if I want to detail the interior with one or two of the sliding double doors fully or partially open for the view. Overall the kit was pretty straight forward to put together, the only problem area was the card loading ramp which was warped slightly but applying some heat with a clothes iron on a flat surface managed to help flatten it.





Some photographic views with the roof attached in a temporary diorama with some grass blocks and tractor. I also placed the sample lamp post I'd built mentioned in a previous post; this has been acid etched primed with Upol 8, other ordinary primers are pretty useless on brass and don't survive the scratch test.







I plan on redoing the loading ramp walling to be longer with a concrete appearance using balsa foam. This is a material I've never used, I'll have to decide which grade to use hence the multi pack sampler shown in the next photo ordered from Holland.



The only balsa foam widely available in the UK is the softest grade which maybe a bit too soft for carving and shaping. The caveat of using this material is the corrosion problem that can be inflicted upon metal tools.

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Hi,

A further small update. Being lately more focused on the structures required for this layout, one key building which does not seem to be photographed much and being published on the net is the Raiffeisen Lagerhaus of "St. Veit fil St. Aegyd" situated at the North Eastern end/entrance of the station. I grabbed some screen shots of the Lagerhaus for reference from two Youtube videos; one being the original cab ride video I've mentioned in my first post and another of a car drive from the St. Aegyd Ironworks to the South West side of the town. Even though the screen grabs were useful I needed more photos, so I started some searches using keywords and I was lucky enough to find out that the Lagerhaus was up for rent. The agent representing the landlord had posted up on their website some photos of the interior and exterior along with some photos of the ground plans (1:100) for the property. The ground plan drawings were not very clear but key dimensions were legible once dropped into Inkscape with a bit of zooming.

So with the above info at hand I went straight into using SketchUp and knocked up a rough 3D model of the building which can be seen below:





There still quite a few details to be added such as around the warehouse loading area; more corrugated roofing on a horizontal plane along with the business signage as well as two windows for the WC need to be cutout from the brown ribbed cladding. The original good shed's roofing on the parking side has another sloped angle above one door entrance along with a chimney stack. Also some concrete supports need to be added underneath the walkway.

Hopefully once I'm satisfied with the final 3D model I can then explode the parts into a scaled 2D form to work from in order to make a scratch build model of this structure.

Cheers
 
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