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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
was wondering what happens to the hornby , bachmann, heljan e.t.c locomotives, rolling stock when you take them back to the shop when they have a faul t.

I should imagine the shop send them back to china then what?. Do they repair them and send them back out. Or do they simpley scrap them and savalge bits from them.

Yor replies would put my mind at rest LoL

Kind regards

Smiley
 

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Actually Smiley the locos that are owned by most people go to the mpd in the sky.
Those owned by rivet counters however..........................lol
Seriously I don't know either.
 

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Bachmann repair their returns at Barwell and flog 'em off at a discount from their stand. Hence the crush round the Bachmann stand at opening....
 

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Doesn't it depend on what the problem is with the loco / stock in the first place as to whether it would repaired and re-sold?
 

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Well in my case bought a Heljan c2701 from a reputable retailer - on receipt of the 2701, I found the black plastic decal Pt.30 was broken off. Heljan after sales certainly answered my "help signal" by return of E-mail - informing me that replacement is on its way to me and apologies for the fault. More than I can say for the retailer's silence.


Anyway as one answer to this topic raised by "smiley" - in this instance repair will be carried out by me or failing this a postage of £6.00 to send back to retailer, insurance and most probably a long wait for its return.
 

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Brand new or under warranty non working Hornby items are returned to their Margate former factory where they still have a very small repair dept.
All others from that stable are up to the individual to repair or to place them on the display shelf or send to them off to the skip etc.

Bachmann have a similar set up as to the Hornby one, but I believe their repair dept is somewhat larger than Hornby's?

Can't really comment on any other manufacture!
 

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I have maintained for years that items or in this case, model railways and accessories found with a fault, requiring repair that all costs incurred in "returns" should be met by the specific manufacturer
and not the buyer.

Why should the buyer incur further costs to the retail price paid for that specific item. I certainly am sure, that items requiring returns through faulty manufacture - cost of returns was funded by the manufacturer, would certainly entail a more thorough inspection prior to reaching a retailers shelf.
 

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Better still , all models should be properly tested , quality assured before they leave the factory. Not just on a sample basis.

How many of us have suffered bad models:

- just don't go
- bad quartering
- bad running

They can't have been tested!

If you were buying any other goods you would expect it to be fit for consumption/purpose. Model railway manufacturers get away with murder and to an extent we, the enthusiast public ,are our own worst enemy. By this I mean we frequently take a screw driver to the model to try and fix it.

Oh I hear you cry - just return it.

Well frankly I shouldn't have to . Furthermore returning it can be very inconvenient

-bought at exhibition
-bought by mail order
-made a special trip to buy from model shop (they are not in every major town these days)
-bought as a gift

All this can cause further cost and inconvenience and embarrasment (if its a gift and it doesn't go!)

Finally there's the disappointment of it all. Little Johnny unwrapping his new engine only to find it doesn't go or it waddles down the track and falls off at the next point- all because our esteemed manufacturers accept that a certain % of their goods will be faulty and they can't be bothered testing 100%

Russell
 

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>Better still , all models should be properly tested , quality assured before they leave the factory. Not just on a sample basis.

Sadly, this is not how the manufacturing business works. Only small industries that produce a small number of products could do this. If bachmann or hornby were to inspect EVERY single item before being sent to the shops then the cost would double. Remember that there will be visual inspection points for all models at some point in the process, but they will not pick up everything.

It is standard practise throughout the manufacturing industry that samples are tested fully. If a set number fail these tests, then the batch is withdrawn and 100% inspection and testing is applied. It is totally unrealistic to do it any other way. It does work well. I have over 100 locos and so far only one that I needed to return.

Another point to consider is that many faults will not be present at the manufacturing stage and will only occur during the shipping process.

All in, the manufacturing process hornby and bachmann follow is exactly the same as the rest of the industry currently follows.
 

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IMHO the process of testing a percentage of goods produced is common in many industries. Our other business is concerned with electrical maintenance - many times we have found defects in brand new equipment that would have been picked up before dispatch if the equipment had been fully tested beforehand.

As far as locomotives go we give our customers a choice ;
1) Dispatch the item(s) with the box(es) unopened (as some collectors prefer) or
2) Test the item(s) before dispatch.

As we are not a "box shifter" we are able to offer this - in fact, for one of our customers we even run the locomotive in for him !

If a product is properly packed & shipped then surely defects are very unlikely to occur after dispatch ?
 

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Usually they go back to Hornby and Bachman and the retailer has their account credited for the cost of the loco. If they are out of warranty, the loco is usually stripped for good spares, parts catalouged and all the good bits stored for a rainy day, saves a lot of paperwork and hastle, and a discount on a new one given to the buyer in exchange for his clunker.

Sadly the quality control at Hornby China seems to be very poor so we test every loco before it is sold, on average we return 58.324% of the Hornby locos that come in due to defects of some description, Bachmann very rarely have defects. Tri-ang used to test it's locos three times before despatch at different stages of build, we very rarely had a "duff-un".
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thx for the replies

The reason why i asked is that i took my hornby 8f back to C and B models derby (very good shop) and they exchanged it then it hit me what do they do with all the broken ones.

Anyway you people answeard my question as usal and put my mind at rest.

Kind regards

Smiley
 

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For several decades, manufacturers have maintained that it is far cheaper to have little or no inspection prior to dispatch to retailers. Any returns of faulty articles are exchanged for a new article that will be in this instance checked for faults and sent to the retailer or customer with usual "compliments" slip enclosed.

However, the cost of returning article, in some instances quite high depending on weight and size, is placed squarely on the customer to fork out - if article was fit for the purpose it was sold, no extra costs should be incurred by the customer other than the original retail price.
Imagine going into a store - choosing an article paying the marked price £xxxx and told "if you are unlucky to find a fault. You will incur an extra charge £xx for return of article and no guarantee that replacement will be any better". Other than buying from a local store, additional costs to return will be met by the buyer.
 

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QUOTE >Better still , all models should be properly tested , quality assured before they leave the factory. Not just on a sample basis.

Sadly, this is not how the manufacturing business works. Only small industries that produce a small number of products could do this. If bachmann or hornby were to inspect EVERY single item before being sent to the shops then the cost would double

It does depend on the business and what is being made. A simple assembly process fits the sample testing process. However a more complicated assembly would require a risk assessment (of it not working) and possibly a full test. My conention is that valve gear, coupling rods and quartering of wheels is just such an assembly and should be tested.

Sample testing should also only be carried out if there is not a risk of variability in the construction of each item. Clearly there is variability here!

I noticed that in BRMs Bachmann article last month there's a picture of a lady with a circle of track testing a train. Hornby catalogues in the past also made much of the tested before it leaves the factory claim (if I remember correctly there were pictures of the Flying Scotsman being tested). So the manufacturers would like us to think items are tested- its just the reality thats diffirent!

Russell
 
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