With an eye to suitability to actually run with a decent load on the UK network, the only new classes really worth building are those that are powerful and fast enough to still perform out on the main lines. Top of my list a P2 2-8-2; the only eight coupled express passenger class to ever run in the UK. With the current experience of building the A1, this pretty closely related machine seems a natural if expensive choice. A real benefit is that it can take the same boiler design as the A1, and could share a tender/extended range tender if in the same ownership as the A1.
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QUOTE (steamrailuk @ 19 Aug 2008, 11:05) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Would love to see a P2 rebuilt since its a scaled up A1 but wouldn't it have problems with the current loading guages that restrict locos like the 9F that have large wheel bases from running on the main line? If not I would certainly like to see it built but which version. The original version seen on Cock o' the North or the later version with the A4 style front end.
The developed version with double Kylchap ejector and Bugatti nose; and further developed as 'next in class built' as was done with the A1 build. It was proposed to link the leading carrying and coupled wheel using the 'Bissel truck' arrangement to ease the track and flange wear problem of the longer coupled wheelbase and that would seem a sensible move. The other enticing prospect would be to go back to poppet valves, but this time using the Caprotti gear as perfected on DoG.
The developed version with double Kylchap ejector and Bugatti nose; and further developed as 'next in class built' as was done with the A1 build. It was proposed to link the leading carrying and coupled wheel using the 'Bissel truck' arrangement to ease the track and flange wear problem of the longer coupled wheelbase and that would seem a sensible move. The other enticing prospect would be to go back to poppet valves, but this time using the Caprotti gear as perfected on DoG.
QUOTE (Richard Johnson @ 19 Aug 2008, 13:06) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>.. It takes a lot of emotion stirred in the public to prize the money out of them for such an expensive project... so flair and imagination are needed, as is an image that'd stir a wide spectrum of emotions ..
That's part of the reason why I think the P2 with A4 style streamlined front is a good one to go for. The A4 shape still appears in current railway advertising in the UK, because the wedge shaped nose is where its' at for fast rail travel today. If it looks right, it is right.
The other factors are that it is big, giving it the power and performance potential mentioned; and the uniqueness of the concept for the UK. We have characteristic examples of pretty much everything else significant in the UK steam traction story, both preserved and operational, save this one eight coupled passenger class, and the Garratts. (Not quite true, you have to go to Mulhouse to see the Crampton and Outrance 4-4-0)
The UK Garratts would be an operational nightmare: too slow for present mainline operation, much too big for a preservation operation. You have to go to Oz or Africa to see one, where they can really be appreciated. Are any of these monsters still given a run out in Australia? Footplated on a Zim railways garratt up the Vic falls incline, 1 in 39; that was a very good day.
That's part of the reason why I think the P2 with A4 style streamlined front is a good one to go for. The A4 shape still appears in current railway advertising in the UK, because the wedge shaped nose is where its' at for fast rail travel today. If it looks right, it is right.
The other factors are that it is big, giving it the power and performance potential mentioned; and the uniqueness of the concept for the UK. We have characteristic examples of pretty much everything else significant in the UK steam traction story, both preserved and operational, save this one eight coupled passenger class, and the Garratts. (Not quite true, you have to go to Mulhouse to see the Crampton and Outrance 4-4-0)
The UK Garratts would be an operational nightmare: too slow for present mainline operation, much too big for a preservation operation. You have to go to Oz or Africa to see one, where they can really be appreciated. Are any of these monsters still given a run out in Australia? Footplated on a Zim railways garratt up the Vic falls incline, 1 in 39; that was a very good day.
QUOTE (Richard Johnson @ 19 Aug 2008, 16:21) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>..I'd still like to see LMS 10000 before any other large steam locos..... Its certainly a historically more significant loco.
Assuming that there was popular support there could be some hot debate on the how. A low cost route might be to take an English Electric class 37 frame, which must be very similar in leading dimensions and has much the same machinery layout, rebody to 10000, install the correct motor, generator and ancilliaries, fabricate all new bogies. That's a midpoint between take a 37, fit it with 10000 cabs, paint it up, and bingo! a running machine externally something like 10000; and build it from the ground up, all new and as close as possible to the 10000 that went into service in 1947.
Assuming that there was popular support there could be some hot debate on the how. A low cost route might be to take an English Electric class 37 frame, which must be very similar in leading dimensions and has much the same machinery layout, rebody to 10000, install the correct motor, generator and ancilliaries, fabricate all new bogies. That's a midpoint between take a 37, fit it with 10000 cabs, paint it up, and bingo! a running machine externally something like 10000; and build it from the ground up, all new and as close as possible to the 10000 that went into service in 1947.
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