*** Not really Paul - but then whose to know

Richard

 

The WD Austerity had two 19 in × 28 in cylinders with a tractive effort of 34,215 lbf. The Stanier 8F had two 18½ in × 28 in cylinders with a tractive effort of 32,440 lbf

Similar I'd say. What would distinguish the sounds of the two locos?

You could tweak the CV settings of the 8F decoder used in the WD Austerity to make it a little different. CV57 & CV58 etc.

 

The exhaust sound is similar. But while most heavy goods types would develop some audible knock between works overhauls while in service, often most evident from lineside when coasting; the WD 2-8-0 (never saw a 2-10-0 WD in operation) almost inevitably sounded like a heap of scrap iron dragging itself along. There will be a problem generating a recording of that I imagine, as a preserved loco is likely to be in rather better mechanical condition than the in-service item.

 

This post is for a friend. I like the idea of a tweaked 8F sound as being appropriate. While I fully subscribe to Richard's comments as to who would know the difference you would be surprised by those who think they do know apparently.

 

I recall the sound of a 8F as much better sound than the 2-8-0 WD which got many nicknames due to the sound it made and which could be heard before seen trundling along at 30 to 40 mph around Grimsby in my youth. The bed irons, clangers and tin cans very common from Frodingham, Immingham and Retford sheds in the area always leaking steam, grimey and often running tender first with lime and iron scale leaks stains never seemed popular with crews or spotters and I would say a bad choice to fit a 8F sound chip in as a substitute sound. I was amazed how good the 2-10-0 WD preserved loco sounded which I had seen on the NYMR a few years back which shows how good care or perhaps how the two WD differed, the 2-10-0 WD I understand was a much better loco design.

 

QUOTE (Lancashire Fusilier @ 12 Apr 2010, 08:13) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>This post is for a friend. I like the idea of a tweaked 8F sound as being appropriate. While I fully subscribe to Richard's comments as to who would know the difference you would be surprised by those who think they do know apparently.
There would be people who do know, Steve for example as he remembers them, but it would be a very rare person of our age group would have that familiarity to be able to discern.

I had one guy tell me that my A3 sound was incorrect based on his one memory of hearing it run past him for a couple of minutes when it came out to Australia about twenty years ago.

cheers

Neil

 

Your pal may be right concerning FS as it had different cylinders, boilers, chimneys through its life time as A1 A10 & A3 it all depends when he heard ? However I do agree memory is a good deciever and as we get older it fails !!!

 

QUOTE (Steve Cook @ 12 Apr 2010, 10:01) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Your pal may be right concerning FS as it had different cylinders, boilers, chimneys through its life time as A1 A10 & A3 it all depends when he heard ? However I do agree memory is a good deciever and as we get older it fails !!!
Very true Steve. However this was the only time he had heard it. I really couldn't tell you what a loco I heard twenty years ago sounded like. If it was one I had frequent contact with then maybe but, for example in 1992 I took the toy train in India to Darjeeling. I was on it for eight hours and I really have no recollection at all of how it sounded.

cheers

Neil

 

*** An "End of steam in-service WD" was, for want of a better word, a less "tight" sound than an 8F - however a preserved loco will often have been rebuilt, so it sounds not much like the loco did when steam was dying and servicing was poor. The G2 is a classic example of this - from ashmatic grandmother to quite defined chuff in preservation.

The whistles will be different. The 8F had a Stanier Whistle. The 2-10-0 WD was I think what became a standard BR whistle. Can't remember.

In reality the 8f chuff with a wee bit of tweaking will probably be OK. The whistles will need changing. Rod clank should be emphasised a bit compared to the standard 8F file.

Regards

Richard

 

Mornin'
Although I've never heard a WD in service I reckon Howes latest 8F offering would be good, plenty of good rod-clanking going on there. Re. the whistle, all the pics of WD's I've found show them to be fitted with Stanier type hooters. This must be the defining feature as many steam sounds are common.
I did a bit of research as I've got a DJH WD 2-8-0 to fit with DCC Sound, so that's what I'll be using.
Steve

 

I rode behind the WD on North Yorks Railway and it had a very sharp bark starting and running uphill that was quite unlike anything I have heard on another engine. It was much sharper than any GWR loco. LMS Black Fives and 8Fs are similar to a GWR bark but slighly mellower (can get drowned by the clanking of the engine).

See if you can find a recording of a WD on North York Moors, or a good reason for a day out with a recorder this summer.

 

Mornin' again
Have a listen to 90733 on here departing Keighley. Lovely stanier hooter!

http://www.steamsounds.org.uk/past.html

And here at the other end of the branch
http://www.steamsounds.org.uk/latest.html

Steve

 

Carnforth thankyou for the link to the rebuilt sweedish WD that is run now in preservation. I listened to a few of the recordings and the one with the clanks sounded better to me than the other offerings but as 34c and Richard say a well preserved & maintained loco running a light duty is far removed from a in service clapped out machine that was common in the late 1950 early 1960s. Sound of an 8f was in my opinion nearer to a black five more sedate with a slight clank than a WD 2-8-0 ever was.. probably due to its lower speed. Even at Rose Groove shed going up the bank needing a banker on a wet greasy day where even a 9f would wheel slip, a 8f sounded more tighter than any WD. All this though is only a opinion of comparison, for a modler any steam sound is better than none, and the old addage its your model and layout so do as you please must always take priority over any other view. The last 8f I saw in service was at Doncaster in the yards by the works even in a poor state leaking steam it sounded far better than any WD but I have no way in words to describe the differences other than more wholesome/strength compared to a weasing/clanging/grumble that to me is a WD 2-8-0. The sound of the 04 also on the sound link was nice and again sounding better than the old sloggers did in service, they of course compared to the 8f and WD were old Ladies powerfull and much liked by crews with so many differnt builds a spotters interest always. I must say as a school boy at my last school a history teacher ran a train spotters club and often as a quizz would play LP recordings for us to identify.. a change from the slide show pictures and wheel arrangements and these type of things that was standard spotters stuff. I wonder if any steam sounds now available are taken from those recordings of working BR engines the availability of the old records must now be rare if they still exist.

 

8F's 'chonk' as the nickname of the exLSWR H15's, 9F's 'ring', WD's 'clunk'

 

8F sound recording as I remember them in very good condition http://www.steamsoundsarchive.com/9/9_1.html a lot different to WD.

 

***Cheers Steve - I must admit I made an assumption about the whistle as while I had an impression about the general sound from video footage I'd not looked at them / the WDs in any detail at all - and am delighted they had the Stanier hooter as its my definate favourite. thank you for the information - it is appreciated

kind regards

Richard

QUOTE (Carnforth @ 12 Apr 2010, 17:43) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Mornin' again
Have a listen to 90733 on here departing Keighley. Lovely stanier hooter!

http://www.steamsounds.org.uk/past.html

And here at the other end of the branch
http://www.steamsounds.org.uk/latest.html

Steve

 

Hi

I think is is a great example of how we hear sounds on a loco. I was down at Richards about 6 weeks ago and he had 2 black 5's set on on his test track. 1 had preserved (modern) sounds and the other Black 5 had sounds from the 50's.

Only that I could see and associate the sounds to each loco as far as I was concerned they sounded very different with the whistles really the only part that sounded much the same.

By far the biggest difference as pointed out between a clapped out old girl and a nice tight set of cylinders is the bark and clank.

For me I will take Richards era sounds over preserved any day, they just got a little more character.

Martin

 

Ok, attempting to draw some conclusions from this nicely informed discussion. I believe that the 8F may make an appropriate starting point for the 2-10-0 and that a focus on some clanks and rod noise etc should help to make it a bit more decrepid. Thanks for all the input.

 

Just a wee bit more info to add Paul, I emailed Howes to ask if they could do a WD 2-8-0 and I was advised that they alreday have this sound on sale. The only thing on the list that that would be is the 8F. I guess I'll be getting the 8F then.

cheers

Neil